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All right. Okay. I think we'll get started. So welcome. Good evening. Thank you so much for joining us tonight. My name is Eleanor. I'm a current I M T and I'm also part of the team that brings you the F three series. So the F three series is um essentially a series of webinars that aims to bring sort of experience and guidance from current and past F threes to help you get the most of your year out of training. This current series we're bringing to you is the unexpected F three. So maybe um so we know that specialty training is very competitive and we know that sometimes people don't get in first time and maybe you were banking or getting into training and at a loss of what to do. Don't worry, we've got you. Um We want to try and turn that narrative around and turn it, turn that negative into a positive. There's so many amazing experiences that you can have and take in your year out. Um So tonight, we'll be just discussing about I M T training. So how to maximize your chances for being successful in I M T training applications. Um So we'll be joined by three current I M T s in the east of England, Dean Ary and he'll be talking about their experiences which have all been really different. So hopefully that will give you a good insight into the different things that you can do with you with that time out and they each speak for around 10 minutes or so and they'll be plenty of opportunities for questions at the end. But if you think of something during, just pop it into the chat box and we can talk about it at the end if we don't cover it during the, during the discussion's. So first up, we're going to hear from Claudia. So over to you Claudia. Hello, I'm Claudia. I'm one of the current I M T ones at Addenbrooke's Hospital in Cambridge. Um So as my colleague, Eleanor um introduced the topic, this is mainly about the foundation your free either uh unexpectedly in the sense of unfortunately, there was some issues with the training applications or you've decided that even though you had a training post, it wasn't in the location you wanted or um hospital you wanted. Okay. So there are some benefits to having a free and some people actually choose willingly to do one. Um the main there, you can group them in four different topics. So um it and every offers you possibilities, sorry, um to increase your research experience um to go back to university either doing a educational degree or some masters, uh do some more clinical work um in the UK or abroad. Australia is a particular preferred location at the moment. It gives you a bit of a flavor in terms of what you want to do with your career. Um Also an every year is a very good time to go traveling and go to some places that are far away and you might not be able to, to go again if once you start training. Okay. So first thing you think about what you want to achieve from your year. Um So just a couple of examples on the slide, if you really want to do some something in research, if you're more academically inclined or you want to get an experience in this, um you can apply for clinical fellows. So research clinical fellows, you can see the ads on linkedin or any NHS JOBS. Um if you really have a topic in mind and you already know what you want to do, you can approach different professors or um which they have their own firms and you can essentially develop the area of interest. Alternatively, if research is not your style and you want to do a bit more medical education of public health information, um you can research universities that offer you courses like this. Um But also you have to be mindful of the deadlines because um every university has a certain deadline for application. Okay. Um in terms of clinical work, you can, you have two options. Um you mainly can go as a clinical fellow in hospital, which is a set contract usually for six weeks. Um Well, minimum of six weeks to six months or you can have a full 12 months rotations. Um Alternatively, you can do you use a locum agencies and then you can essentially pick your place of work and um pretty much your salary based on that. So in terms of my foundation, your free. So my main goal was to get some more research experience. So I was a research fellow at University College London. Um I knew a consultant that specializes in epilepsy, which is the area of interest for me at the moment. Um And basically, I, I emailed her directly express expressing my interest. Okay. Um Apart from the research sort of things because the salary in research is not phenomenal. Um I've talked to my foundation hospitals and uh the hospitals that I've been in as a trainee in F one and F two. Um And we've agreed that I will have like a semi permanent job 3 to 4 days a week in acute medicine essentially. Um So alongside this, I also did a postgraduate certificate in medical education to as I enjoy teaching. And this would give me the opportunity to actually design, help, design some of the courses in university. The last bit is the most fun of it. And I had one month of traveling before I started my internal medicine training. Um when you can also take holidays in disperse throughout the year. So that's a bit about my experience in terms of foundation free. Now, in terms of the benefits, like I mentioned, um you have a whole year without actually having to have a quite a gruesome ro ro to so you have time to study. Um you can do your MRCPI exams. Um if you start thinking about your internal medicine application, um for example, during your I M T, they expect you to pass MRCB Pot one if you have time and you're afraid and consider trying to start studying for that as it can be quite challenging alongside a full time clinical grotta. Okay. Um Research you can, like I mention you can develop new skills, you can meet new, new people and it gives you a bit of an exposure and the specialty of interest. It doesn't matter if you, if you don't know your specialty currently, you don't need to know what you want. But I'm sure everyone has a bit of top five specialties that they wouldn't mind trying to get a bit more experience. So at least then you can have an opinion. So you kind of know what you want to target later on. Um You can also have uh freedom to explore any part of either clinical or non clinical world. And also you have the freedom to have a bit of time off and relax. Um There are some people that think that a couple of drawbacks of taking you out of or um mainly when you're not exposed to, to patient's in the clinical world. Um Sometimes when your back, if you've done full time research with no exposure, it can be quite daunting seeing a patient that's acutely deteriorating on the ward. So I do strongly recommend to have a couple of clinical shifts interspersed throughout the year to keep your skills up. Um Another aspect of actually building your own foundation, your free is that you need to arrange the opportunities yourself and it can be quite hard to start. Um because especially if you don't have any experience in the NHS, um you wouldn't be able to actually know who is best to approach for either clinical job or uh teaching or a research job, but everyone is very friendly. So if you have a hospital in mind or a special team, mine um just Google the hospitals and get the emails from, from the relevant consultants. Okay. So just a couple of tips for how to maximize the your year. Um There's a, a portfolio for foundation, it's called Horace. Um So you can, if you are a foundation trainee, you can extend this um to continue to have evidence of your clinical commitments to. It's quite important when you go to your ERCP to show that you've actually not just sat around at home doing nothing. You, you have some exposure to the clinic toward or the non clinical commitment. Um in terms of internal medicine specialty training, as you already probably know the uh certain subsections. Um It's okay not to have points in everything. I'm sure very few people have that. Um But if you, for example, need points in a poster presentation or quality improvement project or teaching, this would be a good time to maximize this. Um For example, teaching you can do uh you don't need to do a full degree. Um There are some courses that give you a bit of flavor in terms of what teaching design is. Um So that's like three days and accounts one point on the I M T S uh subsection. Um The most important thing is the foundation, your free or a year out of training, gives you the opportunity to understand what you want later on at the end of the day. You know, we're humans, we have to take care of ourselves as well and we have to be happy and we want to do later on. Um So a bit of time here and now it's more important than regretting our choices later on. And uh so essentially, um I'll leave you with this slide is pretty much what I've been talking about in terms of make sure you maximize your time to hit the targets you want in the MT application. Thank you. Brilliant. Thanks so much Claudia. I didn't know that about extending the U R S portfolio that's in credible. I didn't know that that's a really useful thing for people. Take, you know, thinking of taking an F three in any sort of specialty to be able to extend that. It gives you the opportunity to keep a portfolio up to date. And I know that in a lot of clinical fellow jobs that some people do in their F three, they're expected to have an appraisal at the end of it. And they often don't get told about this until a few weeks before and then they're scrambling around trying to do reflections and case based discussion's. So that's really useful if you can extend the horse and portfolio to still use that to be able to record reflections and activities that you've done. And it makes it easier when you come to come to sort of the end of the year and if you do have an appraisal. So that was really interesting. Thank you. Um If anyone has any questions, probably best to leave it towards the end and we can do it all at the same time. But if there's anything specific for Claudia, just flag it up in the chat box when you do ask the question. Um So thank you very much. I will switch over to um to Q. So how are you queue? Um So um Q is done something a bit different series, graduated internationally and then has worked in a number of different sort of rules within the NHS. And he's going to be giving us an insight of what it's like to be an international graduate. Um So that'll be really great. So over to you. Thank you. Thank you so much Eleanor. Uh I would like to thank you for this lovely uh uh session. I think it's, it's really important and when I was in an F three or whatever it was, uh I think it, it was really important to have those kind of, of, of teaching and sessions. So my name is Q AM and I M T trainee currently in Addenbrooke's in acute medicine. I graduated from Jordan in 2017. I worked for a few years and then in general medicine, then I, I moved here in 2020 and I've just started in August. So I'm not gonna talk much. I'm going to leave all of the details for Michaeli because they know the system more than me. But I want to speak about an eye MG point of view. I hope that we got some I M GS who join us today and I hope that it's going to be helpful for them. So I think the first step that I would like to tell them is uh it's normal to have a few months and you, you feel that you are lost, you don't know what you're doing. You feel overwhelmed. This is absolutely normal. Just keep in your mind that you're new in the system. You, this is a whole different country. This is a whole different system. A whole different culture. Everything is, is absolutely different. So it's absolutely normal to have a few months before you start doing anything. Um I think one year as an F three is really important for an eye MG to do all of the requirements that we don't usually use it or we don't usually do it in other places such as quality improvement projects, audits, posters, stuff like that. It would be really handy if you had some teaching experience, if you manage to organize a teaching experience or stuff like that or if you have a leadership or post grad degree. But if you don't, that's completely fine from my experience. I did not score really high on my portfolio. I think I, I managed to get 20 points or something like that and most of the points I managed to get them from, from the UK within a year or so. So I think, don't worry, the most important thing is to start thinking about what you're going to do in this year. Uh start your plan early. The things that I managed to do while I wasn't here is a quality improvement project. So my first, I've done a few of them, two or three. I did not manage to finish the first cycle, but for me, it was good. It was fair enough just to have an experience to know what exactly was the audit? I had no experience before was the meaning of audit and was a point behind the audit on the, on the last audit I've done and we managed to do three cycles. So I would suggest try to have a very short and a quick audit or quality improvement project, try to do as many cycles as you can. Um And trying to make it interesting. So my, my quality improvement project was about VTE assessment. It wasn't, wasn't a very clever idea, but the point that we have done made, made it a bit different is making a cartoon video at the end of the teaching or the end of the, of the Axion and we, we disputed on, on the, on the trust. So, and I think people, they love the idea and we managed to get uh a prize for that in uh RCP regional poster competition. So it wasn't, it wasn't the best quality improvement project, but I think we managed to achieve something and we managed to make it interesting um in terms of, of teaching. So try to join as much teaching as you can try to uh present uh posters, uh something that it's easy, easily achievable, especially if you work in acute medicine. I don't know about other, other specialties. But I know the in acute medicine, if you want to, if you wanna present your poster in the uh Sam or the Society uh Vacuum Medicine. Most of the time they accept many, many posters. So it's a good, a good chance to present in the uh we managed to present to posters, one of them about Myth Globe anemia. It was a very nice case. But the other case, we presented the uh the quality improvement project that we we have done. So what I'm trying to say in here is if you try to do all of those things, definitely you will get some points and definitely will, you will, you will have some, you'll have a uh an interview. The most important part in the I M T is an interview. So try to work on, on your portfolio, make it interesting and try to show that you are interested in, in I M T I think in my interview, all what I've done is just I show that I'm interested, I really want to do acute medicine. I, I really want to do I M T I really want to do medicine and this is why I've been working on over the last few years and I got accepted and apparently I, I think I managed to get a good score. So I did not have any post grad degree. I did not have any, any additional achievement. Um All what I've done, I worked on, on, on my portfolio while it was in, in the UK So I think, take your time in the first few months to settle down to know the system, to know what you're doing. Enjoy your time, enjoy the experience. I think it's from my point of view, it's really important to have an F three as, as an eye, eye MG because it's really hard to get into I M T without getting any, any NHS experience. There is no way to do a quality improvement project outside the UK. At least about, I'm talking about uh my country. So I just want to make you re reassured that it's achievable. Just take your time. Enjoy. I, I know that you worked hard, at least for a year, a year or two or maybe two or three years just to pass your PAPS and to get your first job in the UK. So this is the time to enjoy the experience and to, to go with it. Great. Thank you so much for that. Q It was really interesting to hear your insight about the sort of challenges that you faced and, and how you've sort of helped overcome that. So that's been really helpful. Thank you. Um I just wanted to clarify how long and how many different jobs did you have in the UK before? You? So I would say I graduate in 17. So I've done my f 1 17, 18. Then I've worked for 23 years in Jordan. Then I moved to the U K I've done acute medicine for one year. And at the end of that year I apply for I M T and for between November and August, I've done another, another general medicine rotation job. So basically, I think about two years before starting the EMT. So from my experience, I think it's really hard to get an I M T without having any, any, any UK experience. Basically, it's quite difficult, especially that most of the jobs they got released in, in April. So most of the I M GS, they will start the, their experience in the UK in July, August by the time the others will join their training. So it's really hard between August and November to build your CV, to do a quality improvement project, to do all of those things, unless you are very, very, very experienced in your country and you, you managed to publish a lot of stuff and stuff like that. But I think without, without, without, without having them, it's really hard. Yeah, definitely. And I think you made a really good point about the interview because I think you obviously need a certain amount of points to be able to have an interview. But the interview seems to be. And to that, I think this is across the board in most specialties, although GP not necessarily, but in a lot of specialties, the interview seems to sort of be the main clincher. And I think, although you, you know, might not need certain, you know, the portfolio maybe doesn't make up as much of the points in terms of what your overall score and rank is. I think being able to show that you've done certain things like a Q I project that you've done some teaching that you've had experience in the NHS or experience in different jobs, I think comes across in, in an interview and they can think all right, this person has done this before, they kind of know what they're talking about. And like you say, when you said about when you're in the interview coming across with sort of saying, like you really want to do acute medicine, I think that's the key. I think it's showing that pash in that you actually do really want to do this. Um And I think sometimes having time out can really help you determine, especially what do you want to do. And I had an F three and an F four and I didn't know what I wanted to do. At the end of F two, I knew it would probably be hospital medicine, but I didn't really know. And I think that's so fine. I think so many people who are even sort of halfway through their career don't necessarily know what they want to do at the end. But I think having that time out allows you to work, work out what you do, like and what you don't like. Um, and I think that's really useful because then you can then present yourself as someone who is really passionate in the interview. And I think that speaks volumes. I know that last year and I think it's potentially this, it was the same one um on applications this year. One of the questions is why do you want to do I M T it's like the most broad question ever. But I think if you can sort of talk about why and why you want to do it in sort of very structured and how you can use previous experience with doing Q Y and teaching, which is stuff that you're going to have to do throughout I M T, it doesn't get any any better after foundation training. So you are going to have to do that. So if you can show that passion, then that definitely is um something that will be, will be really useful and it will definitely show in your score interview. Um We um have a third speaker this evening who is Katie, who's just getting set up. So while she's doing that, I'm just going to pop some slides on. So um this is just a bit of a plug for the Portfolio Clinic. So the F three series is brought to you by the Portfolio Clinic. So this is a sort of near peer mentor scheme, mentor mentee scheme. Um And it's the best thing about it. Number one is it's free. But number two, is that it gives you sort of dedicated to personalize um support with your mentor. They can go through the port your portfolio, go through what you've done so far and give you tips and tricks of how you can expand that and how you can improve on that for, for what you want to do long term. So Claudia Claudia was mentioning about um teaching so that you, you know, some people will do a PG search but that is quite expensive um and can take a long time. But there's other ways you can maximize your points. For example, in the teaching section of the I M T application with online courses, which are a lot less expensive, but we'll still give you a good number of points on that section. So by registering with us, you can have 1 to 1 to support as to how to sort of maximize your portfolio and and we can give advice on lots of different specialty applications. So it's not just um I M T and we're sort of recruiting mentors for all specialty applications at the moment. So if you're interested, go find us at the portfolio clinic dot com or find us on um our social media pages. Um And we are also recruiting mentors at the moment. So if you have an interest in wanting to help someone else build their portfolio or develop their portfolio, give 1 to 1 and specialty advice, then please please sign up. We'd be very grateful to have you along and, and please pass it on to your friends. If you know people who want to do ob ob Gyn Gain. Ep, then we're expanding it to all specialties. So please do, please do get involved. Is that something that you're interested in? Um So I think Katie is all set up. So, Katie, I will um let you take over. Hello? Yes. Sorry. There were some technical issues there which have now been resolved. Um So my name is Katie. Uh I M T one currently working in the east of England, Dina re in Cambridge and in West Suffolk Hospital. Um Well, how do I go to the next slide? Oh, just click it okay. That's fine. Okay. So, so this is just kind of an overview of how I structured my f three year that I'm just going to run you through. Um So from August onwards, I did a six month junior clinical fellow posting gastroenterology, which I applied for during my f two year and then in November put in my application for I M T. After doing that six months, I took off a couple of weeks to do some prep for my interview for I M T and to have a look for some locum roles. I then spent six weeks low coming in cardiology at a different hospital. I took two months off to go traveling and then I gave myself a few weeks off before starting my I M T role um to move house sort of get myself set up and um to do some revision for my M R C P part too. So to go a bit more into a bit further detail into the junior clinical fellow post, um that was the Royal Barschel Hospital and reading where I had worked in my F one year and I knew that I liked it there. Um It's essentially an S H O job. I applied by NHS jobs in April and that's where most of these job adverts will go out. I had an online interview beforehand and the job was full time more or less Monday to Friday eight till five on the ward with about one in five weekends covering the respiratory wards, but those were also kind of eight or five days and there were no night shifts which was good. Um Quite a lot of pros for this, for this job. It was guaranteed. I had a work every week and a paycheck every week which was predictable and stable, which was nice. Um I was part of a team and that came with support and kind of all the benefits of being in a training program. But without actually being in one, for example, I designed and lead an audit with a red and super consultant supervisor. I was given an educational supervisor which meant that I had someone to do my appraisal with I got lots of sls done. I did a tab for feedback. So all of this stuff I used in my application for I M T and it also meant that I had a good reference when I was applying for jobs, um, for I M T but also for locum rolls, it gave me lots of experience. I wanted to do the job because I hadn't done any gastro and I hadn't done any medical jobs in my F two year because they were sort of a, any psychiatry and E N T. So it gave me the experience of being a medical S H O and also some clinical skills such as acidic tap and abdominal drains. Um and also kind of being a medical S H O leading F ones and F to sort of starting to get this sort of leadership roles, which is something that I spoke about a bit in my interview for M T having the interview itself for this role. Um was kind of a bit like the I M T interview. So that was quite good practice. And, and I also had a practice I M T interview with one of my registrars, which was helpful. It also meant that I got some paid study leave and I did a taste a week in endocrinology whilst I was there again, which was paid. Um but cons compared to locum work in particular, less pay, far less flexible. I did have to do one in five weekends. Um And so there was the opportunity to do a P G cert funded by, by the hospital, which would have been a really good idea. But you could only do that if you were committing to the full 12 months as, as an N F three. And I knew I didn't want to do that, so I couldn't do the PG search. But if that's something that you want to do that, the option was there. Um As I mentioned, I then went into some locum work. So I applied for these via agencies. I signed up to the mess we website and got in contact with a few agencies. It did take quite a lot of effort to organize, doing all the paperwork, the DBS checks, um, the induction work and lots of phone calls around different agencies to try and organize. Um, but there were quite a few benefits. I got paid 15 lbs our and I didn't have to do nights or weekends. So I'm just trying to get to the next slide a than the F three job was and I could save up some money to allow myself to take that time off at the end of the year that I mentioned going traveling when you apply through an agency, you state your terms. No nights, no weekends, no one calls. It was flexible at a short notice period. In case I wanted to leave, I think the thing I wanted to point out was that in some cases, you can still get the same experience that you might get on an F three roll, depending on the job. I was just on cardiology for around six weeks, which meant I was part of that team. I was just on kind of, I was on a busy D G H CCU so getting quite a lot of experience. Um and you could still do audits again if you're part of a team and you're in one place, you could still do those sorts of things because you can sort of pick and choose a bit more. It gave me the opportunity to try, try out some different hospitals ahead of I M T preference ing that I hadn't worked in before. Um But saying that I, I was kind of lucky in that I was just doing one job, one team and I could settle in, but I know other people who did locum rolls where they were just a sort of a gap filler S H O. So they'd be sent one ward, one day another ward the next day. And that's not very good for your learning and development. Although it is still well paid and flexible, moving around different hospitals, you get very little inductions so it can be a bit disorientated, especially new I T systems. Um You, I obviously have an educational supervisor so there will be less portfolio support. But I wonder if you're particularly conscientious if you could still do those things, but it's probably less simple and to the next slide if it works. Um Just to mention time off was really important for me, I think ahead of starting I M T, which is um full, full time and fill on a bit of time off. Gave me some time to revise without having to worry about being in work and doing nights and things, um taking time to prep for the interview. Um uh going away traveling. So that's just for me, that was a really valuable time and I would, if it's feasible for you to do, I would encourage doing that as well. Um So that's, that's everything from me. Okay. Brilliant. Thank you so much, Katie. Thank you. Um All right. So, um we've had some three really great insights into different experiences that people have had in there. F threes and, and how they've helped, you know, how this has helped them with their I M T application and help prepare for I M T. Does anyone have any questions? Um If you do, please put them in the chat box and we can answer them. I know that we've covered quite a few different topics. Um So yeah, pop them in and we can, we can answer them. Um I suppose while we're waiting for, if anyone does have any questions, I've come up with a few questions. So I was just wondering if you had anything that you wish you'd known prior to taking an F three, anything that you wish someone had told you that would have made your, your year or your time easier. Just general ate it to all three of you. I think I was, I was a bit lucky when I first started I had a really good I M T training. He wasn't S T three or something like that and he, he told me the stuff I need to start working on. So as an I M I M G, you need, you need to start signing the Crest form. So this is a really important thing. It's equiv equivalent to the FY two. So you need to do it while you're in the UK. So he told me you need to do that and you need to do the consultant who want to sign that for you, that you want to do it early on so he can keep an eye on you. And he pushed me to do my uh first teaching sessions and he pushed me to do. But uh my first audit. So I think, I think it's, it's really important to know that those are the things that you need to do earlier on in order not to lose the time. OK. Brilliant. Great Katie or cloudy. Or did you have anything that you wish you'd known before you started or don't get too much on board? Like I've got to feel mainly for my own guilty pleasure. You know, I do like my work but at one point, you know, revising for the M R Sippy, the interviews, doing research with deadlines and doing clinical work plus PD set can be a bit much. So, you know, probably just two out of three to have a bit more relaxed time. Yeah, definitely. Gosh, it's has that you were doing loads at the same time. Wow. good on you. But yeah, I think that's really important about having, you know, not taking too much on because it is essentially a year in between training. So it is your time if, if you want to be to, to travel and to take some time out before starting I M T which like Katie said, I M T is quite intense. So um good to have some time beforehand. Great Katie. Did you want to add anything or? Yeah, I'd say in addition to what the others have said a year isn't very long and it goes by a lot quicker a lot more quickly than you think it's going to. Um So if anyone is in doubt about doing it really just goes by so quickly and trying to squeeze a lot in is really great for your portfolio. But it's also from a burnout perspective, like, like we've said a balance is probably a good thing and you know, F three F four, whatever I know a lot of people doing it now, but it will, it will go by quickly. So it's, it's okay. Whatever you do will be fine because it will be gone in quite quickly. Great. Thank you. Um So we have some questions that have come through. So, um Manzi's asked, what is the time commitment like for doing PG cert? Can you do this alongside preparing for I M T? Um Yeah, 100% I think if I may. Um It's so essentially you need at least 2 to 4 hours a week, you can understand the material and read through everything else. If you're really into the, the topic, you can spend more than that. But in terms of assignments, that's sort of how it works. Um So it is doable if you want to do it during your well, full time clinical commitment, but also it's best to do it when you have a bit more flexibility. Um So I hope that answers the question. Really? Yeah, that's great. And then is also asked um a lot of or also sort of what's the time commitment um for revising for M R C P part one? And can you do this alongside preparing for I M T U M? I think the answer to that would be similar. Um I, I mean, I've, I've been, you know, I think a lot of people, some people do it in their M R C E P parts one and two in there. F three F four years and some people do it while they're during I M T, I took my F three and F four years in Australia and traveled. So I didn't want to be set at my laptop revising. So I'm doing them in I M T and, and it is achievable to do it in I M T training. So I think it's just about what works for you really, and, and again, making sure you don't take on too much at the same time and, but what works for you and what your commitments and what you're priorities are. Um Karremans asked, having concerns about just doing purely service provision as a junior clinical fellow in F three year. Is there any advice that you would give from your experience? Um I think as a general clinical fellow, as you say, the earlier or someone said you're gonna, most of the time you're going to have an educational supervisor, you will, you will have a chance to do a quality improvement project, which is very important to your portfolio. You're gonna have some chances to do a teaching that's also very important. So I wouldn't, and during that year, you might be able to do your M R C P part one. And uh then I wouldn't, I wouldn't just call it as a service provision at the end of the day. You're going to be a medical registrar who deals with all of the medical issues. So it's gonna be really handy to have more experience in different subspecialties because there is no way to do all of the subsidy in the medical subspecialties in three years. So you, some of them they will go missing, for example, you, you might not have a chance to do a nephrology. So, or maybe in the crime. So it's really important to have those experience while you're an F three or four. So I wouldn't just call it as a waste of time. Okay. Great. Um And then another question about PG set if you're doing a P insert, oh, your nausea. Um I was just gonna say a group what type said, but um as, as a junior clinical fellow, you're often the most stable presence on the ward because everyone else is off doing on calls and nights and things. I don't know if anyone else has said this already. Sorry, because I wasn't present for the start. But, you know, really well because you're there and you're the kind of the stable presence week on week. You're not trying to get used to a whole new list of patient's and kind of dipping I/O. So I think in a way it's more rewarding because you, you feel like you can get to know them and kind of make a difference a little bit more. And yeah, and so you can kind of make the most of it. I think that's a really important point. You've made there, Katie actually. And yeah, very important point that you are that stability, that's stable presence and you can get to know them more. And, and then therefore that means when you know, the consultants change or the registrars changed and you're able to get them up to speed quite quickly and, and get to know, you know, what's going on with them. Well, so I think that's a really important point. Um Just moving on to another question about PG Cert. So if you're doing a P G cert from August and completing it in a year, would it still score points with the I M T application as application deadline is around December? No, no, exactly. But it will give you points to talk about in the interview and it will show commitment to um well training because essentially all all the trainees will have to um teach medical students or foundation doctors. So it shows a bit of commitment to the idea of what being a trainee actually means. Yeah, definitely. And I think the other thing to say is that PG Cert seems to pop up on most applications for, for most things and also it's on registrar applications as well. So I don't think it's every a bad thing to do. It always seems to be something that's really positive on applications and portfolios. Um Brilliant. Um If anyone has any other questions, please feel free to pop them in the chat. Um I actually had a question for you, Claudia. When you mentioned you're talking about your research fellow job, you said that you approached the P I, is that princip principle investigator? Yeah. So you approach them? What sort of time of the year did you approach them about that and start planning it? Um, essentially springtime, not now. Um, um, so I just emailed the head of the department that I wanted to talk to and said, do you have any anything that I would be able to help with? And initially they want, they gave me like an interview with multiple consultants and then um once they mainly interested in you being passionate about the job and you actually being dependable, so if they give you a deadline, you have to respect it. Um As long as you have that, then you have nothing to worry about. It doesn't really don't need to be a great scientist and to be able to do some research, brilliant, that's really useful. I think if there, if there are, there are any people listening to this who maybe had hoped to do training from August and you know, not sure what to do next. There are, you know, from, from talking to you guys, there's so many opportunities out there which are available from now, like you haven't missed the boat on, on opportunities. So if, if Claudia, you know, spoken springtime, so there is still so many opportunities available. So that's really great to hear. Um It doesn't look like there's any other questions. Do you guys have anything further you want to add or anything you want to clarify? Oh, brilliant. Well, thank you so much for all coming along and it's been really, it's been really great. We've had some really interesting insight from a variety of different rules that people have had. So that's been really great. Um I will just pop this. Oh, is this um is this session recorded? Yes, it is in response to that. So you can be, you can log in at any time and please, please, please, if you would be able to, to please fill in the feedback form which I've just sent into the chat. Um This means that you get a certificate afterwards of attending and it really helps us know things that were doing well or things that we can improve on. So that would be really great if you could fill that in. Um Please join us next week if you're still, if you're not sure what you want to do for, if you know, if you know, you want to do an F three, but you're not sure what you want to do or you know that you um not sure yet. And then please join us next week. We're going to be joined by a doc doctor who has had an F three N N F four and has had a huge variety of different rules. Within that time. So she's able to give us a really big overview of different opportunities. So please log in it's next Wednesday at seven o'clock. And if you um aren't able to attend, then all of our sessions are recorded. And yes, they're all available on Medal and you can look at them afterwards. So if you aren't able to make anything, then you can always check back in afterwards. So, thank you so much for all joining us this evening and thank you to our speakers. That was brilliant.