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Hello, good evening everybody. Um Please, if you can hear me, can you just comment? Hello as well? So we can know that everyone's hearing me clearly. OK. Hello from You're welcome. That's one person. All right. Thank you. Just give me a few seconds just so we can see how many people can hear me, but I've seen you so far. Hello, I'm welcome. Mm Good evening. Um Please do us a favor and if you know there's a colleague that should be here that has registered, you can send them a reminder or share this with them. That would be really helpful. OK. All right. So we'll soon jump right into it. Talk a bit about it's five till we get to 605. Will that be ok for people to join in? Cause we just went live? Ok, if you need them. So if you have just joined us um welcome. My name is Emma. I'm the public relations officer for Radiology Interest Group, Africa. Um which is basically what the name says, an interest group for um imgs who are from Africa who are interested in joining in radiology. So we provide resources guidance but not just for IMGS as well. We've, we've kind of enlarged our school and we have um African and IMG trainings in radiology who are also a part of us. And the whole idea is just to guide, to be able to provide um direction for a lot of force on the things we need to do to get into radiology and to navigate the whole pathway of radiology in the UK. So if you're just joining us for the first time, this is pretty much a big summary of what we got this about. Um So this is going to be the third part of our research series. Um And my name is I've already introduced my sister, but I would like to just use this opportunity to thank our research league. Doctor Fum, who has been so kind as to organize this and also the founder of um this interest group, Doctor Ken um for putting this together and for giving us the opportunity to host this session. So it's three minutes. We are almost there. 8 to 5. Thank you, sir. Mhm Got it. OK. OK. Thank. Thank you for sharing. If you can hear me and you're just joining, feel free to say hello as well in chat Boxx. Mm OK. You are welcome, Bula, uh Joseph Moya story and feo welcome. Thanks for joining in. Um Right. And thank you very much for, for being here. Uh We'll be popping right into it in about one minute. So I'll start off with the introduction. So like I said earlier, we are Radiology Interest Group Africa and my name is Mara and I am coordinating this session. Um I'd like to start by introducing our speaker. Um Well, if you have any questions or comments, um please, there's a comment section so you can leave your questions, comments and we will address them at the end of um our session. So in this segment of our research series, we have prof ah Maa Ofer who will be speaking on the organization of radiology research in the UK. Um prof will be sharing from a great wealth of experience in research as she has published approximately 361 peer-reviewed articles, book chapters and she has given over 250 invited national international lectures. She is a chair in the pediatric musculoskeletal imaging um unit at Sheffield Children's Hospital. She's a professor at the academic Unit of Child Health at the University of Sheffield and she's the first female managing managing editor, sorry of the journal of pediatric Radiology. Pro has been involved in the development of national guidelines. It's related to investigating suspected physical abuse in Children. And she has published a textbook on this subject. I mean, all this we can say that prop is very well, even more than unqualified to lead this discuss. And we are so honored as we have to have her here today. So without any further ado without any, we'll hop right into it. Please join me as we welcome prop her presentation. Welcome. Thank you for your um kind introduction and thank you for all. Having me here. Um I think it's worth saying that I am. In fact, an I MD I trained in a Mada Bella University. ZA. So, you know, um I'm one of you essentially, we're all, we're all in it together. So I was asked to speak about the organization of Radiology Research in the UK. I have to confess, I didn't completely understand the title. So I hope I'm giving you the, the, I hope, I hope I'm delivering on what you're expecting from me. Um Essentially, I've divided it into two parts and part one is really around the idea of should I do research or not? And the primary question of that is, is it compulsory for UK radiologists to conduct research? And the answer is, is actually no, you do not have to, you're allowed to be somebody who prefers to do only clinical work to be a clinical radiologist and have your full time equivalent 100%. Um um NHS work with nothing to do with research at all to be fair. It's quite unusual for you to have no research input simply because sometimes um other academics will want to use the reports that you have provided. Um And they may add you as an author on the papers if they've done that. But, but you do not have to actually lead on research or do any research. You just take your way, you go your way through as a clinician and, and be happy doing that. Or you may be a clinical radiologist employed by the NHS, but having one or two days a week, one or two programmed activities a week for research. So a little bit of clinical and maybe about 20% of research still employed. Though by the NHS, sometimes you will have an honorary senior lecturer post with the university if you're in a teaching hospital. But then, but if you're in ad DH, you may only have your NHS contract or you may be somebody like me who is an, a clinical academic radiologist. I'm employed by the university. I used to be employed by the NHS and I left the NHS to s to get employment with the university because I was sort of dedicating myself to saying yes, I do want to do an academic career. I want to follow the academic pathway and I have a 50 50 split. But um my, my, my main contract is with the er university. So my consultant contract, my NHS contract is honorary. Um I have an honorary NHS contract. You could be any of these splits and you can go forwards and backwards. You don't have to stay in one. You, you may decide to research isn't for you or you may decide that your home life, for some reason, you, you need to drop some academic sessions as long as your NHS trust is, has got the funding and can find you NHS pas, you can go back or if you are enjoying research so much, you want to increase from your one P A, you may want to go to two or three pas. So it's flexible now for those of us who are not yet. Um you know, I'm just going to go right back to the beginning to say, for example, you've just come from Nigeria or Ghana, which country you're coming from and you've entered here and you're thinking about doing clap or you've got your clap you, you want to do. So what are all the pathways and the clinical pathway and the academic pathway that you may take as a person who is um a medical trainee from undergraduate up to getting your General Medical Council registration, medical school here, 4 to 6 years depending on. But if you want to do academia A BS C, an MD or a phd, you, you may have to add up to an extra two years in that training. You can do it interco which means you do one year within your usually around your fourth year of medical training. Your third or fourth year, you take a year out to do research. You may get A BS C or you may do more of an MD and sometimes you do a phd in that time after your medical training. After those 4 to 6 years, you come out with a provisional GMC registration, you can then go into foundation year one General Clinical or an academic foundation year one. So you apply depending on which you want to do. Um And you do not have to have done a BS C to go into foundation year one or if you've done a BS C, you don't have to go into academia. And similarly, if you haven't got a BS C or MD, you can still go into an academic foundation year one. So it's pretty flexible and then you get your full GMC. After that first year of foundation training, you're fully registered on the General Medical Council, you can congratulate yourselves. Um But then you will still have to do a second year foundation or academic foundation and similar to the others. You can, you can, you can change around. You don't have to stay in one if you, if you don't want to. So once you've got your registration, you've done your second year foundation training. What about getting your certificate of completion of training at this point? You are a doctor, but you're not a specialist in any area. So, and that's what most of us want to become, we want to become specialists. It could be that you want to do um GP vocational training, which is a three year program or other specialty those of us here today, we're interested in radiology. I think that's why we're, we're here. Um And usually it's 5 to 8 years for um subspecialty training. If you're taking the academic pathway, you might decide to become a clinical fellow, you might want to do an MD or phd getting a fellowship. You can be a clinical scientist or you can go for a clinical lectureship and you can see the duration of all of those. The clinical scientist is the longest up to five years. And again, you can swap, you can change your mind. You can go for from one to the other. You can decide academia is not for you or you can decide, you know, maybe I will try academics. So none of these things are hard and fast at this stage. Once you've done all these years of training, you, you come out, you're ac CT, you're a consultant radiologist, you may be a consultant, academic radiologist, depending on, on, on which of those pathways you decide to take of all of these academic options. The clinical scientist is the, is the one you can do before or after C CT. If you've got your certificate of completion of training, you, you, you're too advanced to do the academic clinical fellowship. Um Usually um you may be able to do some of the, the, the phd trading depending on the program and you're also too advanced for a clinical lectureship. Um So then after that, what happens next? It again, it's up to up to you whatever you decide to do, you stay long, you, you stay and you just go up the NHS um salary scale, you know, for the, for the next 30 years of your career or you continue with academia moving up that ladder, senior clinical fellow further at the same time as getting your fur subspecialty training, you may want to be a GP in practice fellowship or a senior lecturer. Um And again, as in all the steps, you can come from clinical back to academia or go from um academia back to clinical depending on what you feel suits you. So if you stay as an academic a lot, if, if your, if your trust is attached to a university, you may get an honorary senior lecturer post at the same time as getting your consultant radiology post. If you continue to do a little bit of research and, and your NHS and you're linked to that university, the university may um award you honorary associate professor or reader depending on the university and honorary professor as the years go by and, and if they feel that you deserve it, that you're do you have to do some research? Otherwise, if you're doing no research at all, you, you stay as an honorary senior lecturer all your years through the um as you work as a doctor, as a radiologist in the trust on the other hand, if you decide to become an academic, you're employed by the university, you have an honorary consultant, radiology position like I do and you work your way up the pathway, becoming a reader or associate professor and then becoming a professor. If you're an NHS consultant, radiologist with an honorary um chair, you can still call yourself professor. So you, you, so that the professor doesn't mean that you're just only employed by the university. Anybody who's an associate professor or professor, either through the NHS with an honorary contract or through the university um is entitled to use that, that, that um title of professor. And is the higher up you go, the less likely you are to change your mind. But it's still possible that you might want to drop some um er research sessions and go back into clinical. What often happens as um people reach retirement is they may drop the clinical sessions and focus on their research maybe until they finish supervising the last BHD student or something. So you can still drop sessions as, as we, as you go along. So then if you, if you are doing research, you, you want to think about what are the funding opportunities? And for those of us, all of us here who are medics, the main clinical funder within the United King. Well, certainly England is the National Institute for Health Research and they have a few career development awards which help you enhance your academic career as, as an academic in radiology. So the N I hr academic Clinical Fellowship in medicine is about, there are 250 this is across all subspecialties, not just radiology. So you're in competition as it were with all the others. You have to have a medical degree, but you don't necessarily have to have a phd or MD. And what this fellowship funding gives you is 25% protected academic time. You apply through Oriel. I have some um website links at the very end. So you, so you don't have to um you can write down if you wish for that, but there are website links to all of this data at the end or you may go for an integrated academic training, clinical lectureship in medicine. It's, it's medicine, the wider context of medicine doesn't mean that you're specializing in medicine and they have 100 of those per, per year approximately. Um It's postdoctoral. Um in comparison to the clinical fellowship, you usually will have had your phd. So you'll be an ST three plus, this gives you more time for ACA academics 50% and it's for up to four years, you apply through your host institution. So you're already in a position in the NHS Trust and you apply through them for this um IAT Clinical Lectureship, further Career Development Awards. This is going up, you can have a doctoral fellowship. You have to have had your preregistration training. So you have to be on the GMC register. This award leads to a phd. So you're committing to getting a phd four years or so. Um If you've already started a phd, you mustn't have done more than one year of that phd at 100% full time at by the time award starts or you don't qualify for this fellowship. So it's really for people fairly early on who then decide. Yeah, I want to do a phd while doing this um clinical training. And then the N I HR senior Investigator award is quite prestigious. It's a personal award. It recognizes individuals who have contributed an, an outstanding way and they are recognized as, as outstanding leaders within the National Institute for Health Research. And then the final one, the top most of the two is the N I HR research professorship. Um And you can be a, a research professorship if you're just based in England or if you're based in any of the other um United Kingdom countries or outside of the United Kingdom, you can go for an NIHL global research professorship. This is far, far down the line, probably if most of you are early on in your careers. Um It's something you can aspire to, but it's not something that you would be able to apply for at this point in time. So those are the fellowships that support individual people trying to climb the research ladder as it were but then there are also research awards that we can all go for, even if you're not um with the university, even if your contract, your main employer is the NHS you can still apply for, for these awards and there are numerous of them. It's quite difficult to, to find a way of lumping them together. But the N I hr again, as I say for, for medical er individuals, the N hr is really the go to source and um they have various schemes er which which um the maximum amount you can apply for. And the level of seniority that you are at is kind of um the way I'm showing it here really. So the research for patient benefit is up to about 300,000 lbs. Um Usually the projects will be 18 year, 18 months to three years, that sort of thing. And it has to show and it has to lead to short term, short to medium term um improvement in outcomes for patients. So it it really has to has to be patient targeted, they all are patient targeted. But this one has to show the benefit in a short term. The health technology assessment is is is slightly more funding and it can actually include um systematic reviews with meta-analysis. So that the actual patient benefit is not necessarily always as tangible and or as immediately tangible as the research for patient benefit. The eye for eye inventions for innovation, that's again, more money usually in collaboration with um a small company, it's, it's really developing um technology. Then we have the program development grants which are smaller amounts of money that help you develop your program grant for applied research, which is the biggest um er um type of um grant that you can go for. And it's usually, then there are multiple different um themes all linking up to answering one big question. So for example, myself around child abuse, it could be ways of um looking at radiographs, looking at ultrasound, looking at MRI, it could be developing A I all of them together with the with the ultimate question being, can I improve the diagnosis of child abuse? So the program development grant helps you um build up your research team, maybe write up the protocols and and do little pilot studies before you um write and apply for the program grant for applied research because that's a lot of work that's um you really want to get that up to scratch in order for it to be competitive for you to um be successful in that application. The well trust is is another and they also do have some fellowships that radiologists might want to um apply to the Medical Research Council is another. Now, the Medical Research Council will fund projects that are slightly less um clinical but can ultimately lead to er clinical benefit. So the sort of mouse or animal studies, Nihl will never fund mice studies. You know, it has to be related to humans. But me, the Medical Research Council can fund those sort of earlier studies. And that's the the benefits of um MRC and well trust PSRC. You might wonder why would we is there research that radiologists can do? Well? Yes, because radiology is actually quite technical. Um and within the Engineering and Physical Sciences Research Council, there will be things like um finite element analysis, creating engineering models of, of, of bones, for example, and working at how the bones fracture um or or developing technologies for looking at endometrial contractions, for example. So you may want to collaborate with um with scientists, computer scientists and engineers and of course industry not just through the I I um funding scheme that I mentioned, but in in industry will make will if, if you have something that's they think is gonna be um really good, for example, then they, they may want to, to, to fund you, you're, you're developing something that replaces ultrasound or you're developing something that attaches to an ultrasound probe that improves the detection of calcifications, for example. So the in in industry who do so semen may actually want to support you to further create that um probe, for example. And then the charities specific charities, if you're looking for um something to do with a skeletal dysplasia, you might go to a particular charity, you know, the, the um the UK the the heart foundations or, or Parkinson's disease or whatever, if you have a specific condition that you're looking at and there's a charity and they have funding scheme, you might want to go to those. And it's impossible for us to ignore the RCR. Um, we as radiologists, what awards does the RCR provide? And they do have a lot and I've put them here, the main ones in, in alphabetical order. There's nothing and there's no order here. Apart from the alphabetical, I think I said before that the RCR combined with the wellco Trust, that's incorrect. They, they, they, they combined with Cancer research UK and MRC um to, to give um training fellowships. So if you know your, your projects would have to be cancer related. For example, if you're going to go with the Cancer Research, UK, Cancer Research, UK Stroke RCR. But then you have all of these various types, the RCR C grant, that was my actual first um grant that I ever got many years ago. Um It wasn't for so much, it was about 5000 lbs, but it did get me on to the scheme and I, you know, it's a good grant to go for, it's not too difficult in application form. Um You can be the lead P I on it straight away. You know, if you're at that time, I was in the first year of doing a phd. Um I thought of the idea that I wanted to do and I wrote the grant and, and, and, and you get it. So it's not too onerous. It's a nice way to, to sort of dip your foot into the waters of, of grant writing if I can put it that way. Um, they, it used to be called the Pump Priming Grant. But now it's the seed grant, but it's all the same. It's essentially a little tiny bit of money. Like I said, maybe 5000. The, the actual maximum sum may have changed by now, but it's to help you start on a project, do a little pilot work and then maybe apply for further funding at to a bigger scheme. Um And then the R and professorship is something that I I also did get. It's, it's um allows you to go to different centers across the country to um encourage people to do research. So again, that's something further along the line for most of you, not something you would go for just yet. I it's for a year. So you don't, it's a professorship at the end, you drop the pro professor you, it's not, doesn't give you the title of professor throughout your career. It's just for that one year, you're the professor. All of these are only eligible to members and fellows of the Royal College of Radiology. So it's, it's if you, if you want to go for any of them, you have to be a member or a fellow of the A a. So then networking opportunities because if you're going to do research, it's really important that you, you, you, you network if you can. Um So how through your local regional NHS Trust radiology and multidisciplinary meetings, you'll identify people just by talking who maybe are interested in doing research, who are already doing research. And if you're interested, you, you can sort of say, gosh, I, I really like this. So I really want to um involve myself and research, start with something small. But if you're, if you're keen, don't put yourself there and then disappoint, it's really important that if, if you, if you, if you put yourself out there that you deliver and what you say you're going to do better to under promise and over deliver than to over promise and under deliver because you're setting it, it, it, it's a bad, um it's, it's a bad, it, it's, it's bad representation and although the, the, the, the, the talk we're giving today is not really about ethnicity and diversity. But if people start thinking these pe these Im DS are not trustworthy, then you're actually spoiling the chance for another I MD. So, so it's, we are each other's um ambassadors. That's what I like to say. So we, we want to maintain our, our reputation for each and every one of us better not to, to go into it than to, to go into it and, and disappoint webinars and online events, something like this, most of us will give you our emails or our Twitter handles at the beginning. Um And if it's something that you're interested in, you, you email a person or you contact them, if there are questions at the end, you sort of show yourself keen. Um And obviously going to national conferences, the RCR itself has a research day each year um which you can attend um or you can submit a poster to as well as attending and, and just mix and interact and show keen, say to somebody I would, I would like to help you on this project. The cr annual conference again is something to go to. And then for myself, for example, I've put up the British Society of Pediatric Radiology because I'm a pediatric radiologist, but there'll be all of these things. They'll be the, they'll be the British Society of um um Musculoskeletal Radiology. You know, they'll be the interventional radiology um society. So whatever it is that you're interested in, um if you go to those conferences, um that's another way of networking, um face to face is so much easier, especially when you're younger because for me, I already know a lot of people and if it um on um in the, if it's um virtual, it doesn't really matter to me. I, I just say hi, how, how are you, how are you? But if you haven't really met a person before, it's often easier to do it. Um, face to face don't be too intimidated. Most people, if you're interested in their research are going to be interested in you, they're going to be, um, and I think flattered is not the right word, but they're gonna be very, they're gonna be interested in hearing what you want to do. And if they themselves, at that point in time don't need someone to do, um, for research, they may, um, sign posts you to somebody else. Um, so, you know, it's, I, I would say to you don't be intimidated or shy to go up and talk to someone or you can do it through a third person if you know that I know someone, you can come to me if you know me and say right, er, am aa, could you please co could you please put me in touch with and, and then I would happily do that for you and then of course, the international conferences, I've put the ES pr as, again, as I say, I'm a pediatric radiologist. The RSN A is probably the biggest radiology conference is huge. It's usually every year. Um, it's in Chicago every year and it's usually, um, November uh, November time. So that, that is huge. If you, if you, if you don't find somebody to, to network within a particular area that you're interested in there, I don't know where you would go to find, um, somebody in the area of your interest. The radiology research map is something the Royal College of Radiology has. Um, here's the um link to the website and it's actually a useful thing. It's got a map and you, you, you click. So here is Sheffield. I, I clicked on Sheffield and it, it pulls up, you see on the left hand column, those of us who are doing research in Sheffield, um and you can click on our um our, our web pages, see what research we're doing. You can have email addresses um and send emails if you are interested. But you know, bear in mind that you don't always have to be on site to do a particular research project with somebody. It's, it's, it's possible to be to, to, to um to be supervised by somebody in a different location or to do research with them and you don't all have to be in the same location. I have to confess that I have not looked at this radiology map for years. And when I clicked on my link, it's, it's not up to date. It doesn't take you to the correct page. You have to still do some searching. So that's gonna, that's reminded me that I will let RCR have the updated link, but that's a useful place to, to um to look and find out um who is doing what research where um and maybe um contact people if you're interested. And then there's this um radiant the Radiological Academic Network for trainees. Um And this is just exactly when you go to the web page, which is at the bottom of the screen here, you see that it's a collaborative network for diverse trainees across the UK. It's supported by RCR. And the aim is to improve patient care through multicenter research, audit and quality improvement projects. So you can get yourself involved in any of those that you, you see at the bottom. But I um I cropped off the bottom but there is a link where you can register, you can email to learn more about what's going on and to participate. And um they, they're, they're keen to have any trainees um in involved. You can maybe put up your own forward a suggestion for a project or involve yourself in already ongoing projects. And they do have um at least one annual meeting that you can go to, which is also good for you to network with other trainees um in, in, in improve your, your, your sense of belonging and wellbeing if you decide that you that, that the full blown academics is not for you, but to give yourself maybe um an opportunity in future or to show your trust that you are interested in research. Um a little bit that you understand the importance of research, you can actually just go for an RC R research certificate. And um the, the, the U, the URL is at the bottom here of the screen um to show you where to find out and, and really, it's the aim of the scheme. I think it's been going on for about 70, gosh, 2014, it's been going on for maybe nearly 10 years. And the aim of, of it is to recognize your personal commitment to reset beyond the requirements of the training curriculum. So it's um and it's to promote research among non academic radiologists and allow you if you, if you want to take up a post in a teaching hospital where in teaching hospitals, research is quite um important to them, er, in, in comparison to maybe the, the district General Hospital, but it's to show them that you are actually committed to and you understand research. Um even if you're not actually on um on um a full blown academic contract um to be eligible, you have to be a radiology trainee in a non ac F post. Obviously, if you're in an ac F post, if you remember from the earlier slide, you're already committed to doing academics, you're, you're already an a um you know, an academic clinical fellow. So there would be no need for you to um go for the research certificate and then really what you do is you have to fulfill 10 categories with um the details you can find on the website. But um it's things like um presenting, publishing a paper, taking part in some research, maybe um the peer review of a, of another paper. There are 10 of these things that you have to do and you just complete your portfolio, submit it and you end up with a research certificate which then you can put on your CV. And when you're going for your job applications, you can see. Yeah, I may not have got funding. I may not have got a grant per se, but I know all about research and here's my research certificate to prove it. So then what are the pros and cons of, you know, I, I've told you you can have an NHS contract or you can have a university contract generally. And they are not huge bullet points. Really. If you're on an NHS contract, even if you're doing research, there is absolutely no pressure on you to obtain funding and there's no pressure on you to publish papers. Um you know, particularly if you're on that 100% the NHS is not paying you for any research pas at all, that's fine. And you can, if you do your research, you're doing it in your own time, which is the, which is sort of the negative because if you have got some academic pa A s they are protected for research. So you don't have to do it um in your own time. And depending on your contract, there's variable on call responsibility, which then gives you more time also to focus on your, on your research. Um, I no longer, I haven't done on call since II, I was at Great Ormond Street before. I wanted my phd. I came to Sheffield in 2009 and I haven't done on call since then because you don't have enough clinical PA A ss to maintain all your skills that allow you to then be on call. So, it, it, it's, um, it doesn't mean I work fewer hours. If I'm gonna be honest with you, I do work lots of hours. But, but if I go home and I want to write a paper or write a grant, I know I'm not going to be called in. But so that time is mine. Um, and there's a lot of independence and flexibility around having your, um, er, research pas, so then if you, er, if you've decided you want to do research the second part, which is why I didn't know if this organization was the sort of the general organization that I've shown you or whether it's, you personally organizing how to do your own research, which is why I've sort of covered um, both conducting research, organizing the research to conduct it in. The important thing is to identify a question but not just any question. You know, if you're going to do something you got to be interested in it, it's got to pique your sort of interest, your inquisitiveness, you've got to want to know the answer not enough to know, want to know the answer you. It's also gotta be important enough. It's gonna be worthwhile. How might you identify this question then discuss with your colleagues, go to multidisciplinary meetings, read journal articles, go to webinars and conferences, see what other people are doing. Sometimes an independent researcher will put out an application looking for somebody either locally. So I do it a lot if I have um a project that I'm doing IIII I put um, an email out to all the trainees and I say, hey, I've got this A I project and I'm looking for somebody who's gonna do it. Ideally you should be in year two or three because it's gonna take three or two or three years and you need to do it while you're in your training. Are you interested? So somebody who's already an independent researcher, um, and sometimes some as an independent researcher, I may be looking for a phd student. I already have funding. So you look out for those job adverts and, and it's just, you don't have to think of the idea, but it has to be an idea that you're, you're interested in researching dedicating the next three or four years of your life to, um, if it's for an MD, er phd, um, and patients in public are another way, you know, you're, you're doing an ultrasound scan on somebody and the mother or father asks you a question that makes you think that this is so true. Why, why are we doing it this way? Maybe we can do it another way. Um And so that's, that's and remember when I'm seeing colleagues for those of us who have trained abroad, our colleagues don't have to be here. Our colleague could be somebody back in your country of origin with, with things can, can we do a collaborative cross nation, a multinational study? Um So don't think widely um in terms of, of all of all of these, that last bullet point about patient and public involvement is really important, not just in identifying research questions, but in how your research is actually done. And the health research authority have got this nice definition. Patient and public involvement in research is not, is is research that is done with or by the public, it's not the research that is done to about or for the public. So, so it's patients are involved in research because you're saying I want to do ultrasound scans of children's um appendices and look for the features of appendicitis that's not patient involvement. The patient involvement is is in saying, yeah, we actually would like a study done on us to see if ultrasound is better than CT in um looking for appendicitis, you know, that that sort of question and I want to be on the grant application for it. And um I want to go out and go to the schools to tell to the Children that they should participate in this. So this is how that's the difference. And most funders will now want to see that you've got patient and public involvement um in, in the project at at least at one stage, even if not through the entire project, then you wanna ask yourself. So I have this fantastic question. I'm really interested in this question. How, what is the best way to answer it? Should it be by audit? Because it's not always research um audit. And I think you've had some talks on all of these is looking at data that you, you're collecting in your department and comparing it to a standard and seeing. Do you meet that standard? A service evaluation is similar to an audit, but it's not comparing it to a standard. It's simply saying how, how are we doing? Um Whereas research, the difference between research and on all of these, the other two is that research is developing new knowledge, it is answering a question that maybe hasn't been answered or it's validating the answer to a question that, that people aren't sure if that first answer was correct. So that's what research is. And then you've got to decide whether it should be done retrospectively. So just going back looking at images already on your PAC system or prospectively, you know, the advantage of a prospective study is if I just went back and said, right, what are the ultrasound features of um of appendicitis? As an example, um it could be that you're just looking at what's already done. And my technique for scanning a patient with, with suspected appendicitis might be different to somebody else's. And in fact, I might have been scanning for appendicitis when the clinical indication wasn't appendicitis. And so it's not very neat and clean. Whereas with a prospective observational study, we can say we must scan only patients who are between this age and that age who have had their symptoms with this duration or that duration. If we're, if we're scanning, we must scan in this order, we must use a probe of this frequency. So your observational study is much neater and it could be a diagnostic accuracy study where you're saying we're not just looking for the features, but we're looking for how well do these features correlate with the surgery with surgery being the reference standard. Um And also we could be comparing CT is the, is the diagnostic accuracy of CT better than the diagnostic accuracy of ultrasound. And with radiology, you're, you're really best in those sorts of diagnostic accuracy studies to also look at observer reliability into observer reliability. How do I diagnose it compared to you an intra observer reliability? How do I diagnose it today compared to in two weeks or three weeks time? So, so you know, for to get really good answers, you want to do those sorts of things or you might want to do a randomized controlled trial. And mostly these ones are, are done where the radiology is used as a biomarker, uh as an endpoint for, for example, for a drug, you know, does, does if, if a person has Crohn's disease, does giving this particular drug, uh compared to placebo or compared to the previous standard of care drug, um cause the, the inflammation to reduce faster. And so you, you, you randomize the patient to drug or, or placebo and you do your CT or your MRI um of, of, of the bowel to look for bowel wall thickening and, and you see which, which one treats the patient faster. Your research team that you build, needs to be diverse. And, and I say that not just in terms of specialty, which is important, you must, you have to have a complete team yourself, other clinicians. So if it's a cardiac thing, you might want to have the cardiologist involved. If it's something to do with the skeleton, you might want to have the orthopedics involved. A statistician, always a health economist, economist sometimes and then your patient and public representative. So a full team, but also in terms of protected characteristics, you know, it's really important. Um And, and, and it's because it the, the question, the answer to the question may be different in people of different sex or of different race, you know. Um and we, and a lot of the time we have just a uniform patient population. And I think that people need to be saying to themselves, we want more diversity involved and involve everyone from the beginning or if not from the beginning as early as possible. It makes the, the, the design of your study and the running of your study so much easier. Um You want to confirm who is doing what and when, and especially if you're academics, you want to confirm authorship who's gonna be the first author, who's gonna be the senior author because those are the two that count the most and what's the order in the middle? If somebody is purely an NHS person, they don't really usually care. Um And in radiology research, it's the first and the last author in some, in some other areas, it's the 1st, 2nd, 3rd in that order. But no, if you're the senior person, you're going to be the last author. And if you're the one that does most of the work, the, the junior person, you're the first author, it's important because that's what people will look at if they're going to give you. Um AAA phd Popo, how many first authorship have you got at this stage? You won't really be a senior author, but it's really important that you're a first author. And also if you've done all the work, you actually deserve to be the first author, then you want to look at the grant application administration process, write your grant, include a chart really important because that tells you how to order things. Wait for the outcome, nothing else you can do once you've submitted and that can be up to 12 months. Sometimes grants are in two phases. Have you pass the first phase? Then they ask you to resubmit and have you past the second phase. So up to 12 months, then you, you get your grants p you're happy um and take up to six months longer to actually set up the study. So from the time you had your research question, idea, to the time you recruit your first patient, you may be looking at two years. And the reason for this is that the the ethics approval, remember, you must have ethics approval. You do that through the IRS and through the Research Ethics Committee, you must have your local R and D approval. Do you need patient consent? Usually for these prospective studies you might do and then they look and, and it can take quite a while. But by the time you've done while that is going on, you want to set up a steering committee, these are usually people intimately related to the grant to the research question and they make sure that you're the study is progressing that you're adhering to the protocol. They look at patient safety. This is slightly different to the advisory group who are often external people who are experts in the field. Um give you an independent opinion and I give you additional expertise. If you're having real difficulty recruiting patients, they might say to you, try this or try that. If your, you know Mr technique doesn't seem to be right. They may say, well, do this, use this coil whatever they, so they are experts that give you a um a neutral eye, an independent eye on what's going on and then you want to conduct the study, you know, recruit your patients, go ahead and do it clean the data, analyze the data, which is usually the, the statistician and then disseminate. And next week, I'll be talking about what um editors look for in publication. But the, the, the main thing that the um the university will be looking for is not just that you've got the journal publication, but they'll be looking for the impact factor of, of that journal um within your field, you know, because some areas will, you'll never publish in, in lancet, you'll never publish in nature genetics just because of the area that you're in. But if in your field, you're publishing in the in the journals in the highest qu a then that's impressive. That's what they want, learn to manage your expectations. I haven't really gone into the frustrations of, of, of research. But let me tell you that recruitment usually takes far longer than expected. There will be unexpected challenges and don't change the protocol to fit your expected or your wanted results. Remember that every change you make to the protocol will require research Ethics Committee approval for the amendment that you have made. Um And you mustn't make any change even if it's just employing somebody else. Find out from your R and D office now that this other person has joined my project, do I need to go back to ethics? You just don't want a situation where you're, you're breaching ethics. It's, it's really important. So I guess I kind of rushed through everything. I hope it sort of meets um the, the, the, the brief of, of the title that I was given. Um And yeah, research may be challenging, but really and truly from, from, from my experience, um it's, you know, it's, it's wonderful. It answers all the questions and it is actually um rewarding. Thank you. Thank you very much. Oh, that the links. Thank you very much for um the insightful presenting. I really was down a lot of things to share. One of the things that I, I really took away from that and it's, it's not really related, but you said it's better to under promise and over deliver than over promise. And I really took that away because as Im Gs what like what you said that each other, those if you get there and um you, you need to do something, it, it's good to do it right the first time then coming around and, and spilling you see, in ***, you're spoiling the ground for the people that are going after you. So, thank you very much for that presentation. Um I also learned, I'm just from a few things that I wrote down. I didn't know about radiology. My, that's a bit naive on my part, but this is I'm hearing about it and I'm really going to look into it to see maybe I could volunteer with some people who would I have a question. I think I'll start with the first question. So for someone like me, I, I have not worked since I've been in the UK, I've been in private but on the pathway radiology. Um What would you advise research wise wise that I can do as one who has an interest in radio, who also has a portfolio to be able to get to that point in my journey. Um Being in the NHS. Would you say it's the best place to be or advice in general? Thank you. I think that you can, you know, you can do research even if you're doing it in the private. Um Do you want to put your camera back on? So I can, I feel like I'm talking to at least one person rather than talking to myself. Thank you. Um Yes. Er, you can do research even in the private um arena, you know. Um If, if you're keen to do research, the best thing is to find um somebody in either in your private hospital who's interested in research, but a lot of them will have, um, close by NHS trusts and so you could find someone to link in there, which, which may be easier for you to do. But it, but it doesn't, it doesn't stop you. It doesn't preclude you from doing research. Ok. Thank you very much. Um, any other qu I can't see the comment section. So I'm just going to be asking if you have any speakers done any questions section? All right, I'll give you a few seconds. Is, uh, is this question and chat bit being recorded or is it just the talk that's recorded? You mean the chat books? I think it's been? No, I mean, are we being recorded as we, as we're answering the questions? Yeah, the entire session is, um, we can edit it. Yeah. Yeah, it seems nobody, people don't have questions to, to ask it. It seems so they usually, I guess, do the people who have people who are here? Do they have an interest in research? I'm presuming they do. That's why they joined. Are they already doing research? Anybody already doing research? Yes. I think a lot of, uh, within, as of Africa, we have a few of us are already doing some research in their trusts, radiology needs it. So was so good. There were no questions, which is what I think it was from my perspective, but I'm really, really grateful for, uh, we're really grateful to have you here today. And um the truth is joined in. I was so sorry I was saying thank you to everyone who is saying, who's saying? Thank you very kind words. Next week, I'm talking about publishing. Yeah, I have to get your work published. Yeah, I want to say to people that I'm very keen on this, on this. I took up the you mentioned at the beginning that I was the um the first female editor of the journal Pediatric Radiology. That's true. But I'm actually proud to be the first black editor of pediatric radiology. It, it tells us that it's the um it's the only international journal for pediatric radiology, but we have close to zero papers published from outside Europe and America and Canada. So that was the platform on which I applied and presented an interview. And it's really, I'm really keen to encourage people from IIMGS, but also people who are based in our home countries to um to, to get better at writing papers and doing research and publishing. If it's going to be an international journal and it tells the world it's an international journal, then it should be international. So if people can spread the the the idea of the talk next week and that we look, I'm looking to um I want to do a special edition of for pediatric radiology coming from Nigeria as a because I trained in Nigeria. So if people can put that out. It'd be really, I'd be grateful. Yes. So we will do our very best to share it because we started getting feedback on this and lots of people are excited and look at the next session. So we'll do our best to share it and make sure we invite as many IM as possible. I personally am really by and um, I'm a bit nervous. I'm great. Me but, oh goodness. No, no, no, no, no. If I'm not approach approachable, then I've failed. It's not about being really grateful for this session and we're looking the next session. So just like Ted, we're going to be looking at how to get your work work published from an editor's perspective and we encourage everyone, especially IM GS um to tune in register. We'll be sharing the registration links from to. So we would expect um more people signing up. Um If you have any questions, I would like to call on Doctor Keeny, our, the founder of frig out, just give us a few comments while we are on this. Doctor Ken. Are you there? Ok. Thank you. Hello. Good evening everyone. I was supposed to make um some announcement, but I'm kind kindly doing everything. So um like she mentioned, we are going to be having in a weeks time and we're gonna be having the second um um talk from um about the s perspective about um on how to get published. Um Before then we, we we, we still want to make sure everyone is aware that um the, the application for membership of um Rega is open. So if you're interested in radiology, either as a medical student or your own career, um medical doctor or um a radiology trainee, and you feel like your um interest aligned with um the definition of um we be happy to have you. And um we would like to collaborate together, sort of like support ourselves through the journey of um navigating um this speciality and um exel in it. Once again, I'd like to thank both for rearranging our commitments to be available for us today. It's um it's been a privilege and actually a very great um educative um experience to uh to listen to the talk and learn from it. Hopefully, um all the attendants or all the attendees and would one way or the other be involved in research um by, by, by reason of attending this. So, thank you once again. So we'll be round in this. I'll be thank you very much. IA thank you. Thank you very much. So, is it the same link for next week or is it a different link? It, we'll publish in another link um for me next week. Yeah, thanks. All right. I'll see you next week then. Thank you very much, doctor. Yeah. All right, bye everyone. Bye.