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Overseas Nursing, where to start and what to think about

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Summary

This on-demand teaching session will explore the benefits, legal matters, and other considerations of working in a different country for medical professionals. We will discuss the opportunity for nursing professionals to immigrate to various countries and how to go about it successfully. Clinical Director of Lonely Nurses, Joanne Holes and Nurse Educator, Vanessa Teague, will be sharing their experience and expertise in both the industry and immigration legalities. Ultimately, Vanessa will be giving advice on which options to pick and how to get started. Attendees will be able to ask questions, participate in the conversation, and get a certificate for their portfolio.
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Description

An insight into expanding your nursing career to work overseas.

Presented by LWN Clinical Director Joanne Haws with Guest Speaker Vanessa Teed

All delegates who attend will have the opportunity to receive a certificate of participation for CPD and access to presentation slides on submission of evaluation via MedAll.

You will need to be verified to participate in the chat on webinars and for future access to your certificates and any reflective notes you make in your profile.

Verification is available to healthcare professionals globally, you can find out how by clicking here

Learning objectives

Leaning Objectives: 1. Understand the different benefits of working as a nurse in a different country 2. Identify the various steps to take when considering an international nursing opportunity 3. Become familiar with the different boards of nursing in various countries and their respective regulations 4. Develop an understanding of the information necessary to begin the process of acquiring an international nursing position 5. Evaluate existing resources available for nurses interested in working in another country
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Computer generated transcript

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The following transcript was generated automatically from the content and has not been checked or corrected manually.

Good evening. Um, everyone. And welcome to this really special learn with nurses in conversation event this evening. Uh, my name's Joe Holes. I'm the clinical director of Lonely Nurses. I'm a nurse myself, and I'm absolutely delighted to be joined this evening by Vanessa Teague. You'll see Vanessa there on the screen. Vanessa is also a nurse, and she is a project manager at Flynn, and she's also a nurse educator at El Camino College. Is in Los Angeles this evening. So it's It's a good morning to you, Vanessa. It's evening here for us. Um, in the UK, I think you're eight hours behind us, aren't you? Yes, it's about 11 AM here, approaching midday. But anyway, we thought we would, um, put on this session. Um, Michaela, who you will know, and we've both spoken with vanessa and, um, very much share, um, the the ideal of wanting to support nurses to be the best that they can be and have the opportunities available to them to do what they want. Um, I've loved and continue to love being a nurse and having nursing as my career. And it's, uh, you know, provided so many opportunities for me. And, um it does for nurses all around the world. And I've had the great pleasure of working with a number of nurses who have come from other countries to work here. Um, in the UK And I'm sure everybody with us has had a PSA similar experience and or perhaps worked overseas yourself or you're thinking about it. So we're just gonna have a bit of a chat. Really? And do I can see some highs. High red Too high, Zoe. High Una. Um, hopefully you found the chat window within medal here so that you can join in the conversation and ask any questions as we go along. And, uh, yeah, participate. As you wish. Gonna talk to Vanessa for about 25 minutes or so. There'll be time for questions throughout, and then we will just pop in a little link to an evaluation form for you. Many of you will be familiar with what we do here using medal and you'll have You'll have seen those before and there'll be a certificate for you as well for your portfolio. So, um, let's kick on. Vanessa, thank you so much for joining me. I'm really excited to talk to you, but especially because I know you have your cute little Chihuahua beside just met. And I'm very much a dog person, and I've got my two dogs with me. So we're all set and prepared for when they join in and start barking. But to kick off Vanessa, you you've involved with a lot of people working overseas. What do you see? Um, as the benefits of working in a new country as a nurse. Well, thank you, Joanne, for having me. I look forward to answering all of your questions and more if anyone has any extra questions at the end. Just a quick background about myself. So I seem a little bit qualified to have this conversation. Um, so I'm an immigrant from Can id a born and raised in Canada's moved to the United States. California, uh, became a nurse about 15 years ago, and then a few years ago, I went back to school and became a nurse educator. Um, teaching is my new passions, Even though emergency medicine is my nursing pash in, um, And then recently, I accepted the position of, um, product manager, which is essentially responsible for the nurse experience with Flint, which is an international nurse recruiting, uh, firm. So I got a little bit of everything. So to answer your questions, or and have I have I experienced the the international nursing myself, Or how did you wear that? I apologize. Well, so yeah, you you over and you're nursing in a new country. But what do you think? Overall, you you deal with lots of people that are moving to you. Become a nurse in a different country. What? What sort of benefits Do you think there are two going giving it a try somewhere else? Absolutely. Um, this is this is a really, you know, important question. Because as nurses, we all have our own scope, scope of practice, our scope of comfort. What kind of unit do we like? Do we like it the same all the time? Or do we like change? Um, are we looking to grow in our profession? Are we looking to grow in our education opportunities so benefits can be quite large. So you know the basic ones? We have nurses immigrating from Africa, uh, Nigeria, Pakistan, the UK, Australia, Mexico, and Candida and some of the basic basic benefits are opportunity, safety, security, power, water. I hate to say it. That's been asked, um, so a life change or better change for their family or for themselves? Um, so that's kind of like the overall human aspect of it, right? Um, adventure. Trying new things, nursing aspect. Specifically. Are you looking to grow professionally as a nurse? Are you looking to change because we know that you know, the UK nursing practice is maybe similar, but still different than the United States, so you could learn a lot from that transfer. Um, as well as the education opportunities in this country are unreal. If you ever wanted to go back to be a nurse, practitioner and educator or nurse in ethicists or there's plenty of opportunity, so many, many positives. However, it's really what is good for you. What are you interested in? If you like a safe place, that doesn't change. Or do you like constant change? That's a little bit of everything. Sure. So if people are thinking about it, I I guess the question first of all is where to start. Yeah, it is very It can be very overwhelming. Um, the nurses that I've met so far that have done some of it themselves. I was just like, I am so proud of you. This is hard work to get started. So to kind of just summarize it simply you You have to know what kind of nurse you would like to be in the United States or in the UK. If you want to go from the US to the UK, what kind of nurse do you want to be in another country? Respectfully. You need to stay within your scope of practice, Right? So if you're just dealing with babies, you should probably stay with babies in the other country. You shouldn't do a big leap like that. I wouldn't recommend it. Um, so stay within your scope somewhat. So, for example, if you have, er ICU, you do have some wiggle room, you could do surgery. You could do medical surgical, you could do clinic. You could pay, maybe even transfer with training somewhere else. So it's really like the first thing. What kind of nursing are you interested in? Um, and if you want to stay the same, then that's kind of easy. You can just start looking for positions in the U. S. Um, whether it's on national organization websites, um, international job sites like indeed or whatever or individual hospitals for positions just to see what's out there. But, um, to start, you really need to figure out where you want to live. Because, I'll tell you, in the United States, every single state has a board of nursing, and I'm not sure how it is in the UK, but every board of nursing has their own rules and scopes and regulations. So okay, if I would apply in California, the rules would be drastically different or somewhat different in Georgia versus Wisconsin versus Florida. So let's just say, if you decide that you'd like to be a medical surgical nurse and you're interested in Florida and Arizona and Texas, where it's warm, right, you could start their turn to narrow down your search. Which one would be a good start? So the answer your question, figure out your own scope. What are you even looking to do? Um, and then kind of start narrowing your search down to state, pick a state. Where would you like to live? Um, And then from there you can kind of start looking for jobs within those areas just to see what's out there. So that's kind of a starting point. That's like the beginning part. So it's a bit like dating. Really? Then kind of, you know, before you start looking into what's out there thinking about now, what do I really want? What's important? Um, and considering that and then start, I guess, to try and find a match, Um, for for what you want and what you want to do. And you know where where you're going to be able to do right? Absolutely. And I mean, you need to be true to yourself and say like, you know, you I personally be in the ER and not 100% fan of working in the med surge area. However, if I were to apply another country and and pick the Med surge area, you need to be true to yourself and say, Do I really think I can do this for 1 to 3 years? Because sometimes the contracts when you're dealing with immigration will be that length. So it's kind of that aspect also, Yeah, so you kind of possibly tied in for a little while once you've made your decision. So you want to give it lots of thought and planning, I guess before. Yes. Absolutely. And this is when the nurses wanting to do it independently. This is the strategy for that. Um, of course, there are companies out there that you know, you can pay a fee, and they'll do all this for you, and they'll place you and you'll have x amount of contract. Um, I mean, I know that my company, Flint, will sponsor you will place you. Um those contracts can be anywhere from 1 to 3 years. We'll find you a job based off of your skill. So really, you've got a couple of different avenues. Okay. So you're the matchmaker. Yes. That's like one of my favorite parts. And I'm like, Oh, what do we got here? Oh, ventilator certified. I like that. Yeah, Absolutely. Absolutely. So in terms of, um, you know what? What kind of support do you offer? Um, I guess there are obviously many organizations that would be doing a similar kind of thing, but you know, to to seek that that that help and support and guidance from a professional organization that will help you with with with finding somewhere with finding a placement. What sort of support is available for people? Absolutely. Um, Door. And I'll keep this really broad to because this conversation that we're having can pertain to a Canadian nurse going to the UK could be a UK nurse going to Candida or to the United States. I just happened to be practicing in the United States, so my references are related to that. But it can be in any country in any direction. I do know nurses that have been, uh, in Mexico that have immigrated to Germany because there was nursing opportunity. So the really this is a worldwide option at this point. Right? Um so in relation to the United States, um, there are different options. We'll talk about that in a second. But to start, um, I'm not. I'm not sure what exam it is in the UK, but it's the in CLECs, which is in the the US I think Candida and Australia, which is the national board exam for nurses that must be taken and passed in order to work in the United States as a nurse. So that's kind of like the biggest hurdle. One is finding out where you want to work. What do you want to do? Um, and then applying to a state that you would like to live in, Um and then that state will introduce you to take the in CLECs exam. So in part of answering the the support, there's various levels of support. So, like I said, there are companies that you can pay that will help you with the immigration part. If you've already done a lot of this by yourself, there are nurses that independently get there in CLECs, and then they look for immigration assistance. Uh um, I have been like Flint. Um, we actually sponsored you from start to finish with the process. We have our own and clicks prep program. We want you to do well, we want you to pass. Um, and then we also have, like, an English as a second language program. So if nurses are having issues with their English proficiency will help with that. So it's like Flint at least has a as a start to finish approach we sponsored. Then we place them with the hospital. They're hired directly with the hospital. So the commitment to the hospital. Therefore, to us is, you know, anywhere from 1 to 3 years, depending on the country and the placement stuff like that. So that's the first. Well, the first option is doing it yourself and then trying to find immigration somewhere, whether it's a hospital or private company or there's companies like Flint that will be start to finish. And they really believe that in every country at this point, there are nursing organizations like this that that will do this, uh, service. I just recommend that you be careful and you do your homework, Um, so that you choose a good one. So? So on that note of using a good one and some some of the challenges that can come up. What? What? Really? Um, what are sort of the common and key challenges that you've seen an experience for people that want to go and work overseas? Hmm. A lot of that, the honestly, the most common challenges are financial right. This process from start to finish is quite expensive. Um, so if you're coming from, even the UK, like some some board of nursing is, they'll require fingerprints. Well, that takes time and money. Um, applications take time and money. The ankle X takes time and money. Um, this international language exam takes time of money if you have to take that, um, so it's quite pricey. So that's really the the number one across the board, maybe even across the world, perhaps is is the biggest obstacle. And that's why nurses do seek outside sources. And also like, I guess I didn't mention like hospitals independently. Some of them will have international nurse programs, and those are really credible programs. And you just apply and we'll see if you qualify and the hospital will sponsor you. So, um, there's a lot of different options. You just kind of have to know where to start. Um, and then another obstacle or issue that Just do your be safe. Do your homework. Are they a public company? Are they on social media? Are they ever like what are the reviews like? And really read the contract really read the contract to make sure that you're not going to get uh, tied into something that you're not comfortable with, So those are kind of like the biggest obstacles, but I feel like there are similar, uh, issues. When we apply for a job, you got to read the contract, right? How long are they going to keep me here? Yeah. Yeah, definitely. And and it's, you know, it's a it's a big you're You're potentially Uprooting yourself. Maybe your family, you know, and and maybe moving halfway around the world. So you do wanna want to get it right. And and so once people in your Reince move, I know that many of the nurses that I've worked with, uh, here in the UK they'll kind of get an initial placement somewhere. And then people think, Okay, I'll move around. I'll go and try a different area of the country. I'll move to a different area of Europe or whatever. So But, you know, here we have kind of one set of rules. You know, we have a big midwifery council that that that covers the country. We don't have sort of different sets of rules, uh, as you seem to in state state. So I suppose it's a bit easier to yes around. Uh, can you? Absolute. So let's just say you immigrate to the United States, for example. Um and you come in and you have your contract with the hospital. Um, and then you fulfill that contract based off of the terms of your contract, right? You're in the United States. You've gathered whatever immigration that you need. If it's proper, then you can easily apply it for another job in another state. Or maybe at that point, let's just say you love your job so much You stayed there for six years and you're in a good place to travel nurse like the the opportunities are still there. Uh, initially, though, if you you do go in, um, with an expiration services, whether it's through the hospital or a private company, um, there is some sort of a contract that, um, you'll have to fulfill. Yeah, and And so Zoey's asking, um, in the chat here about contracts. And what is the average length of contract? Great question, Zoe. Thank you for that. So it really I'm gonna give a vague answer, but it's also a good answer. So it depends on what country you're coming in from. So certain countries will qualify for an expedited visa. Um, and they could come in on a one year contract. They really could, uh, because it's a different visa type, which I'm not completely qualified to talk about visas, but to give perspective. So that could be that scenario of one year. Perhaps if you qualify. And then you also have other countries that, um, have a, like, a longer visa or maybe even a green card application. Uh, situation those contracts could be averaging three years. Yeah, at least from what I've I've seen, you know, my company in the hospitals that we're working with, So we shouldn't really expect probably to be tied in for much more than that. Three years. It's right. That's just that's just average what I've seen. Yeah. And I mean, everything is unique to you too. What country You're going to, what country you come from if you're having bargaining with the actual hospital alone or if you have another placement company. All of those, um, contribute to that final decision that you make to to move and work in a different country. So yeah, yeah, it's an important decision. It can be done. It can be done. Absolutely. But it's a it's an important decision, right? I mean, I would love to move and live in the UK I I feel like I I love it, but I would be a little nervous to, like, make the change, right. Where would I live? So you might be a little cold. Yeah, I know. I have to find a nice place in the countryside. I'll be so happy, You know, I'm in the countryside and by the seaside. So not bad part of the UK to be in, but yeah, it just it makes a difference. I mean, we're quite Ruhr along here where I am. And you know, a lot of the nurses that I've worked with overseas have been in the hospital where I trained and where I worked as a hospital based nurse. And there are really little communities have developed with our groups of overseas nurses. You know where we had, You know, I worked with a really significant number of nurses from the Philippines, and, you know, they have a Filipino nursing association. They have, you know, social events and all kinds of different stuff. And so I'm guessing it's probably the same sort of thing everywhere, isn't it? Where people will have those kind of support networks? Absolutely. I'm so glad that you mentioned that because not everybody realizes that there are, like the, you know, the Hispanic Nurses Association. Or like you said, the Filipino, uh, nursing association. So there is individual, uh, support to, and then you don't have to immigrate to a major city. There are so many small town countryside hospitals that also need help, too. So I think to put the perspective of your countryside next to the ocean, I I'd like to go there. Yeah, I guess it's sort of what you're coming from as well, because, you know, probably going to be a culture shock anyway, isn't it going to a different country? But if you you know, if you're from the country and then you go into a, you know, really busy city, it might be, you know, more of a culture shock than if you, you know, going somewhere. That's simple, right? Right? Absolutely. And that is the one benefit, like as a nurse myself. And, you know, thank you for sharing that. Yeah, it's not for the faint of heart, the one benefit of going through cos like such as Flynn or the other ones that are out there. If you decide to do that is they might put 5 to 7 opportunities in front of you. And you can choose based off of your skill level. Of course. Right. Small town, critical access, big city behavioral health. Perhaps, you know, all kinds of different options. So that's like the one positive of having some assistance in this. But that may not be for you. And you can just pick the one. Um but yeah, if you like a a small town that you can look for that or a big city. Depends on the individual. Yeah, and is it the in terms of you mentioned languages a little while ago Isn't, um international? Um, language testing is this that we have the I think it's the international language language test, I think. Yeah, that the Eilts I don't even know says I just love to say that Eilts I don't know. I Eilts is the is the British Is the British exam? Yes. The international language exam were big fan of that. It's it's just got a good test structure and it seems that our nurses do really well testing with her. Is there also the tough all, uh, and there's one, uh, the O E T. I think it's an occupational. So there's actually a few different language exams that you can take to apply for these things, at least in the US But the aisles and the tough all are like the most common. So, yeah, those are you know, you have to study if your if your language is difficult for you. And take that, um, it is going to be required, um, for immigration purposes. Okay, Um, now, I don't know if anyone has any, um, other questions that they want to, um, drop into the chat. But please do If there's anything that you want to know or anything that you want to add, any experiences you have yourself of, uh, obviously, you know, uh, um struggled, uh, took some time. Get in your US license on your on your own, you know, But, you know I know, you know. You know, as a Trojan, she'll make anything happen, You know, there's there's lots of sorting out for us that then when nurses and runs the show for us. Um, so she would definitely be able to do that. Hands down. Um So what would you say? Um And I guess, you know, in the job you are, Of course you're gonna say go for it. But any nurses at the sitting there thinking, you know, I think I might want to give this a whirl, uh, looking for a new challenge. Would it be just a straight go for it? Well, considering that the process can be timely again, depending on what country you're coming from and such, But if it's like, let's just say the u K to the U S or the U S to the U. K. Um, you will have a little bit of time to think about if you want to change your mind, Um, like the process of applying and stuff like that. So, um, we as nurses, we survived the pandemic. Those of us that had were on the frontline and even those that were not so much respect for you all. Honestly, if you want to do something in your career, now is the time. You know it's it's up to you. I think that, um, I would never, ever pressure anybody to immigrate. Um, I immigrated. It was a culture shock for myself. I I managed, but, uh, and my mom, she actually immigrated from Candida to the US to work as a nurse. I wasn't working in the US before I came from Candida, but, um, and she said it was really hard for her to adjust to the pace and medicines and stuff like that. It was It was a quick transition, but it was still, it was still a transition, right? So all of these things kind of take place. And then there's younger nurses like my sister. She's like Travel Nurse. She just pop into a place and, like, great, all done, you know? So it really depends on again, like I keep saying it. But it's so true, Like we're all different. A nurse is not just a nurse. Nurses are unique and independent, and we all have our own style. And that's what's so beautiful about these worldwide opportunities is you can pick what's best for you, or you can stay home and get another dog. You know, uh, I like that option. My dogs wouldn't allow me to move, so that that would certainly not be allowed. Yeah, and I don't think they'd like the plane, right? But he, too, is asking us about shifts. So I I guess you asking about shifts in the US, which Vanessa should be able to help with. So are they the same here as the UK half hour shifts? Um, is the first question, and then she's asking about newly qualified nurses as well. Yes, I'd love to answer that. So going back to your your your skill set. So if we're going to go into a hospital basic all of the units in the hospital that we know. Or maybe you have a skill set for behavioral health or surgery or some type. So the average nursing shift is 12 hours. Absolutely 12.5? Yep, that's standard in the hospital. It will vary like, for example, we're placing some of our nurses in a surgical center, and I asked, What are your shifts? And they said 8, 10 and 12. So that's very common for those types of facilities that have that, Um, and that's the same. Like I worked in a hospital in surgery. It was the same thing. The 8, 10 and 12. They stack their shifts for the surgical rotations. You know, so average answer is 12.5. But if you're coming into a specialty such as surgery or maybe even, you know, behavior health, it depends. It could be, uh, different type of shift. So if it was eight hours like a surgery center, it would be usually to get the full time hours. It would be 55 days a week, or if it's 10 hours, it would be four days a week. But the average full time schedule for a nurse in the US is the 12 hours as full full time seems like the same kind of full time hours. Yeah, absolutely. And newly qualified nurses. So if you have graduated from a nursing school, whether it's a diploma or bachelor, uh, bachelor's are usually more sought after by facilities, um, and then cos as well, but you can absolutely nurse in another country with a diploma. There's nothing wrong with that. Um, so if you have graduated, um, and if you have some kind of experience, whether it's three months or six months, you can apply. You'd be surprised. I don't I can't speak for the UK or other countries. I mean, some of the facilities are okay with with new nurses. I don't know if they want them day one, but maybe with like, while the process is happening, you're working and getting three months while the way it might be. Yeah. So Flint currently doesn't accept new nurses. However, that is not out of the question in the future. So because things are changing, you know? Well, yeah, and I think it is so variable. Um, what's available to newly qualified nurses, even here? Nurses that have trained and qualified in the UK You know, they're always used to be the expectation that, you know, you go on to a hospital ward. And you, you know, you've got to work there for at least a year or two before you can even think about going and doing something else. But, you know, recently, now we're seeing newly qualified nurses going into all kinds of different roles, um, in the community, into primary health care and things. So do, uh, opening. Um, and I worked with during covid. I went back to my old intensive care job, and I I worked with this most loveliest, and she and she was a youngster. Um, lovely young lady who was brands banking, newly qualified from India. More group of nurses had come to the UK and arrived at, uh, just at the start of covid. Uh um new country, second language. Um, global pandemic. Yeah. You know, I have so much admiration. Yeah, because my goodness, I thought it was hard for me coming back after being out of it for a number of years, but just, uh but yeah, she was amazing and took it all in her stride. So it's, uh, in credible. So absolutely, we have another question from red to here. She she's graduated tons of experience. She's a British citizen. Would she still have to complete the language test? Good questions. I love this. I'm ready to answer. Okay. So usually the I'll to the Taffel relating to the credentialing services that at least plant uses. Um, I went to receive GFMS myself. We use G s A and a lot of other things, but there's so many different companies you can use for credential. But my point is they will require the the I'll to the Taffel. So those criterias usually means like the Australia or the the UK, Or can ID. I think there's another country. Sometimes you don't have to take it. But in this case, I'll give you an example. And then you can decide, Uh, whether you qualify or not. So we have a nurse that she's a Canadian citizen. She's coming over to us. She asked me the same question. I said, Okay, where were you born? Where did you have your nursing education? And it was in India, So she she has to take it. So it really is going to be. Where is your country of birth? And where did you take your nursing education? Even in Africa, when they're trained in English, um, they still have to take it. So yeah, I think that if you're interested, you could always look on the board, nursing website or if you're gonna use a credentialing service, um, going into the United States, they'll have that listed as well. But the bottom line indicator is where were you born and where was your nursing education? Because if it's not in the UK, Candida, the US Australia think there could be another country. Um, you'll have to take it. I hope that helps. Okay, So largely all and graduated both in the UK, so I think we're good. Surely that. Yeah. It sounds like it fits. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Don't let you know. And that's the beautiful thing, too, about this. This process is you are going to get hard stops along the way. So let's just say you completed all this stuff yourself like Luna did. And if you're missing that one piece, like the language requirement, they're going to tell you, so you'll know. Yeah, well, I'm going to see if there are any more questions out there, and then I'm I'm I'm going to ask you, Um ah, she's good instructions. You know? You see, you know, uh, you know is going to be your your assistant in all of this. Yeah. So, um, yeah, I'm going to ask you, Uh, might sound like an odd question, but oh, no. Let's go with Richie. Richie, how? I'm pronouncing your target target question. Um, and then then I'm going to ask you my question. Um, other jobs currently. You know, I was going to ask that when you said you were interesting community nursing. That was I missed that one. Um, if you look at sort of community based placements. Is it all hospital, um, recruitment that you work in Vanessa, or are there avenues to look at community based nursing? Right. So currently, we're looking at a hospital systems critical access and neural areas we're looking at, um, like, you know, but we haven't branched into clinics yet. Um, or community health, however, like Flint is is one agency. Um, but that does not mean that you can't find an amazing community based nursing career yourself online and apply for it, and they might actually sponsor you. You'd be surprised. Especially like the REL communities. Yeah, you might want to check that out. But currently, myself and, uh, flip, we're not taking community nursing. Um, but we do. Um, so if you apply, if you were to apply and you wanted a community based nursing like very very clinic base or or outpatient, perhaps of that sort, then we would tell you that we don't have any current contracts in that area. But I'm sure were one of, like many, many companies like this. So I think you still have many options. It sounds like you're a great candidate. Fabulous. So my final question I was going to wrap up with a question. Um, the US will will. Will it be a welcoming place? The nurses that are coming to to you to work from overseas? Very good question. This is such a pleasure. These are all great questions, you guys. So I'm not the one immigrating right now. Well, I will. I promise that it's like rainbows and unicorns for every single person know. But you may know that in the world we are all quite severely short on staff. So come that comes with stress. Burnout. Um, so myself, I traveled during the pandemic, and then I settled. Um, even then we were short staffed everywhere. I worked in many different facilities. But let me tell you, whenever you get these nurses in, whether they're international nurses or temporary staffing, it's like, Oh, my God. Oh, my God! Thank you. Thank you so much. Oh, my God. So that's at least and, you know, I can at least vouch for, like, multiple hospitals in California. I've only been in California reacting that way. In the general sense, though, I mean, to be completely honest, the staffing shortage, at least in the U s I know. It's similar in Candida and different parts of the world. Nurses are in the severe shortage, right? So the management is appreciative. The staff are appreciative and the patient's benefit. I'm sure this is probably the same for around the world if you jump into another facility. But in the United States, we need the help and the facilities. All I can say is the facilities would not be interested in international nurses unless they were ready to accept them in, because it is a commitment. They want you to stay. We spoke to I get to meet with the hospital partners myself, and they really talked about retention strategies. So if you are really looking for a place to live and stay some, we'll sponsor your education and they'll help you in the community. There are like, uh, one community. Colorado had, like a community, lay as liaison through a church that welcomed in like African nurses. Right, So you really get gems like that. So when you are searching for your job, wherever you are in the in the world, ask for those things, like, what are your retention strategies? What's a long term plan? for one of your nurses. Do you sponsor further education? Are their communities around here from my Children? Are the school's good? Because those are the questions that I ask personally for our nurses, Um, that you're more than welcome to ask for yourself that will improve your what they call like landing. It will improve your landing experience, your transition experience and your long term experience, because the the nurses that we place, we want them to stay. We want to place you in a in a job that you like, Um, and it's a good match, and then you live here. So I hope that answers the question it does. Thank you. And you know, as I said at the very beginning, as you know, when nurses there's always a job for us is always a home for us because of the work that that we do that is so needed around the world. So thank you so much, Vanessa. It's been really interesting, too. Learn about all of these different things and different considerations that that certainly I didn't have, um, huge thank you to our participants. Um, read too. Good luck in your search for whatever job you would like wherever you would wish you every success with that. And thank you so much for joining us on this loan with nurse session. I'm gonna just drop the little feedback form. Uh, chat. There is my is my contact information included somewhere on your flyer? Um, sure. Sure. Do you want to pop it in the chat? Sure. Oh, just in case someone's question did not get answered. Indeed. And if anything comes into us at learn with nurses, then certainly we can. Well, perfect you anyway, because recruit Vanessa, I know I took the semester off from teaching. I'm just, like, itching for education. I was sending, like, voice messages to my the nurses. They are preparing for the and I'm like, Okay, I'm getting ready for the day, but I'm going to tell you about medication safety in the United States. So I'm like, I'm like, dying for education. You will be welcome. Learn with nurses with open arms and we never let good people get away. So we will definitely be be Vanessa. Thank you so much. Wonderful. Thank you. Joining us again then. Bye Bye. Bye, everyone. Yeah,