Computer generated transcript

Warning!
The following transcript was generated automatically from the content and has not been checked or corrected manually.

Good afternoon, everyone and a very, very warm welcome to today's session. Um You've signed up for a session, er, run by the Incubator for clinical education research. Er, and today's session is about coming up with a research idea and writing a research question. Um So now is the time to opt back out if this wasn't where you were thought you would be. Um but hopefully you will, you will stay um for today's session. Um This is part of a series um that we are running called getting started in medical education. So it's very much for newcomers, er, beginners. You don't need to know anything about clinical education research. In fact, um this is especially for you if you don't know anything, if you know a little bit and just wanted a bit of help or may even be that you're having to write a research question as we speak. Um And again, you're very welcome. And in fact, those of you who are experienced and know what you're doing, you're also welcome. Um But just to say that incubator runs some other sessions, um some sessions called mastering the basics. There's also some sessions for supervisors. Um, so do sign up for all, all the stuff that we're doing as an incubator and the aim of the incubator is it's simply those so some of us who are into medical education um are trying to promote it and encourage more and more particularly clinic, clinical um educators to get involved in a bit of research as well. Um So that's who we are and why, why we do it. I will um introduce ourselves. Um and then explain the format for the next hour. Er, so my name's Hugh, I'm a half time GP in Middlesbrough. And the other half, I work at Newcastle University as professor of General Practice education. Uh and I'll ask Lily to introduce herself. Hi, everyone. So I'm Lily Lamb. I'm a GP as well. Um And I'm also at Newcastle University doing an, an I HR doctoral fellowship in the area of medical education and I'm supervised by you fabulous. Um And as I've said already, today's session is on coming up with an idea in writing a research question. Er, now the format for the next hour, the first half hour will be relatively formal and um basically Lily presenting some stuff um with some examples from both myself and from Lily um for the first half, half hour, then the second half hour, um we'll, we'll be going into small groups um for people to discuss ideas they've got, and we'll give you the, the specific task to do within small groups and then we'll come back at the end and if they, if any individuals or any groups, er, do have questions, then that'll be the time to ask them, uh, in some ways we would love this to be a small group of a few of us and where we could hear from everyone and their ideas and their thoughts. Um, but given that we have a few 100 people who have signed up, um we won't be able to do that. Um But hopefully that within the small group discussions, if you're able to stay for them, um you'll be able to hear from others and maybe even get some uh ideas from other people that you're, that you're with. Um I think that's all. Um And just to say that within this, this um the medal program you can see us. Um But there aren't videos for with in on stage, which is the large group we're in now, but where we're in small groups would encourage you to put on your video, your cameras and your mics that you can talk with others, but we'll give you some clear instructions of what to do in the small groups after we've done this session. Um So I will pass over to Lily to start us off. Thank you for the introduction here and I'm just gonna share my um powerpoint, which is a PDF apologies if you can see the toolbar at the top, but um hopefully you can, you can see the rest of the slide. OK. So yes, our session is on getting started and coming up with an idea and writing a research question. Um And these are the session aims. So we're hoping to help you understand the process of turning an idea into a research question. We're gonna share our own journeys from moving from an idea to research question. We're gonna share some of our top tips for developing that idea and then give you the opportunity as you said to, to consider your own research ideas, aims and potential questions. Just a reminder, um this slide was shared at the previous session, but just a reminder about what is clinical education research. Um We are the part of the NIH R incubator for clinical education research that is research which has the understanding of or evaluation of any aspect of clinical education. As its primary focus, it asks, the question tends to ask the question, what works for whom, why, how and in what context? And it's a critical, critical component of scholarship in health professions, education and the scholarship of discovery. Um So we're not basic science researchers, we're probably not going to be talking much about quantitative research today. Um But if clinical education is your area of interest and that can cover anything from evaluating um simulation sessions right through to workforce, um then, then you're in the right place and there's a QR code that will take you to our website if you want to have a look. Um So we thought we'd start by sharing our own journeys from um an idea to research questions. And um all research really starts with an idea. Um I, um, as I said, I'm a GP and have been since 2015. Um, and very early on in my career, I got involved in medical student teaching at my practice and I really, really enjoyed it. I was quite disheartened to hear how few medical students wanted to be GPS. Um They seem to either have been put off by the GPS they'd encountered so far or they'd heard hospital consultants um dismissing the idea of them being a GP. So they were really quite negative about a career as a GP. And most of them seem to want to be neurosurgeons, which I thought was interesting. I don't think we need that many neurosurgeons. Um So, yeah, I felt really frustrated by this. As at the time back in 2015, 2016, we were going through a recruitment and retention crisis in general practice that is ongoing now and probably far worse than it was then. And, and it, it made me start to think, you know, what are we doing? How are we getting this wrong? And around that time, there was a, a pivotal report that was published written by Valerie was who's now my external supervisor for my phd and that was a collaborative report from the Medical Schools Council and Health Education England. And that report highlighted the importance of GP role models and how they can really encourage students towards a career in general practice. Um That got me thinking more. I then ended up having a serendipitous meeting with here at a medical educators meeting where we talked about this idea and, and he really encouraged me to think about doing some research in this area. Um So I went away, did some online searching, came across another report written by the college, the Royal College of GPS, which also highlighted this issue, found research papers, opinion pieces that were relevant. And that led to me applying with few support for an NIH R funded in Practice fellowship, which brought out some of my time to to really focus on this research area. So II was funded to do four sessions a week um for 2.5 years as part of that fellowship. And I did the Masters in medical Education and a systematic review um during that time. And that focused on what's the impact of all modeling in general practice me medical education that then gave me time to talk to GP colleagues, talk to medical student educators, talk to patients, talk to students. Um And really listened to the experience of role modeling. I um looked at some theory um around role modeling and over the course of the kind of 45 years. Um I started to formulate an aim and some research questions for A phd. These were revised many, many times. The writing, the application form took about 18 months in total, many iterations. Um and then decided on an appropriate methodology once we kind of finalize the research questions. So the time it took a long time, but the time spent um designing the research led to a successful NIH R doctoral fellowship application, which was the next step after the in practice fellowship. And I'm now doing a phd looking at how well modeling can be maximized to support careers in general practice. And I started that 18 months ago, supervised by Hugh. And I'm really enjoying my research. So that was my story um over to Hugh. Thanks Lily. Um So my story um goes back a little bit further than Lily's, but that's because I'm a li a little bit a touch older. Um And it was prior to certainly prior to this job job, prior to any educational research that um I've done, I've done since um S and it was, I was a GP, mostly a GP at the time and I just had one session a week as a teacher educator at the, at the university. And I, I'm guessing that many of you guys may be predominantly clinicians practitioners um with just uh a bit of a side interest in, in teaching. Um And I'd done the diploma in me in medical education found it really interesting. Uh And as part of the background, one of my er modules I've done was looking at a particular current educational initiatives was the module title and I've looked at globalization uh partly because I've worked abroad er in North Africa. And so I was really interested in this concept of whether you can we teach the same things, medical education. Sh should it be the same worldwide or not? So that was the background. I then heard that um at Newcastle, we were gonna be opening a campus branch campus in Malaysia, I was not involved in the senior team at the time. And so certainly it was nothing to do with me in one sense. But I was just fascinated about this idea um as to whether well can you just teach a Western um curriculum in a different country? And I just started asking questions. Um and just as a, as a warning, I think if any of you ask questions, then you'll probably end up doing some research because you realize that actually most of the questions we're, we're asking whether it's clinically or in education world um haven't always been answered. And so the way to answer them is unfortunately, to then have to do some research. Um So I spent my life trying not to do research and then eventually doing some because I keep asking the questions. So my question was, well, w would it work. Um And I had some, uh I suppose, concerns as well as interest in it, having done a module um looking at globalization and then thought actually the, you know, the, the best way to answer that question is to actually do some research and find out some more. Um And then as normally it happens with projects that starts on really wide. So, my, you know, my first question is d does, does it work to have a Western uh curriculum in the Eastern context? Got narrowed, narrowed and narrowed right down as you'll see later on, er, in the session as to what my questions eventually ended up being. But obviously I had to narrow it down and looked particularly at communication skills because that was my, I guess some of the science behind what we do is gonna be similar worldwide but how we communicate it and how we communicate with patients must be very different. So I decided I'd be interested in answering the question and then thought actually the, the, the best context to do that would be within, doing a, a master's project. Um because I'd have a supervisor that would help me think through how to, how to do it in a structured way. Um So that ended up being my master's project um, and topic which we'll come back to, er, soon. Thank you. You sorry, just going back to the presentation. So, research ideas, they're really important or research starts with an idea as we said, but anything can really turn into research. It doesn't have to be necessarily something you see. That's positive. II, for me, my research started from a place of frustration and um it was a really good focus from my frustration. It, it meant that I could do something positive about the problems that I was seeing with recruitment, general practice. Um So yeah, problems questions, potential solutions can all turn into research. And it's the research that turns an idea into an action when it's done well, qualitative research tends to ask how, what, why or who. Um whereas quantitative research tends to be more about does something work. So we both are in the field of qualitative research, research design. Sorry if this the text on this looks tiny. Um But research design is simply means the overall strategy which is used to answer your research questions is critical to guiding that process of conducting the actual research. And a good design process outlines the background, the theory, the aims, the research questions, how you're gonna go about data collection and then finally, the analysis and if you design your research, well, it's much more likely that you'll be able to answer your research questions. So it's worth going through these stages. So we wanted to share some of our top tips for that research design process. Um I think really important to find a topic that interests you um find something that matters. Be curious about what you encounter in your daily educational practice. If you find something frustrating, don't just write it off as being frustrating. Try and think about what you could do to, to make it better. It's important that it's something that matters to others as well as to you. Um It and taking action to research can be a really positive process and lead to future changes that others will benefit from. Ultimately ask yourself, is the question worth asking, will others be interested in the outcome? And I'd really recommend just talking to people and talk to others who share your experience in clinical education. Ask them about the topic or the issue that you've identified. Is it something that matters to them? Do they know of any existing research in this area? Is it something they think is worthy of investigation? And will the findings be of interest to other people? And at this point, it's also worth thinking about people outside of clinical education, friends, family members. Um They can all provide a really powerful and valuable perspective on whether your idea actually makes any sense and is important. And are there any other key stakeholders that you can talk to, for example, undergraduate students? Um they can really help refine your research topic and provide a different perspective and in my experience, they're really interested in research. Um So if you have an opportunity to do a teaching session with them, and chat about research at the end of it, often you'll get some, a really different and interesting perspective. So it's worth doing. It's important to spend time reading and thinking. Um, you know, research design isn't done in, in a few days. Um, and it's important to have that foundation of, um, of time. Um, you're not attempting to do a formal literature review at this stage, but it's an important to kind of gain that broader understanding of the topic before launching into researching it. What are the gaps in the knowledge, what's already been explored and what further research is recommended in this area? Often you'll come across papers that um are in your area of interest and they'll have recommendations at the bottom in a box of fur further recommendations for future research. And that can be quite helpful to help you decide where you should be looking. Um I started with Google scholar, I think it's quite a good place to start. You can ask a specific question. For example, how, how can students best learn venipuncture? Um You do get thousands of results which kind of feel a bit overwhelming. Um They often the first couple of pages of results are the most relevant textbooks, either online versions or hard versions in the university library can be helpful um and helpful for references as well. And then the other thing that I've used is the emerging search engines that use A I which can give more accurate results um to the questions you're asking. So, inputting the same question I mentioned about venipuncture can produce some really highly relevant articles which answer that. How can part of the question rather than just looking for the keywords of students in venipuncture important to make notes as you go um and keep a record of relevant references, keep them all have a decent filing system um from the outset because it's really easy to lose sight of what's relevant if you use n not or other reference management software, kind of, it's a good idea to upload the references as you go. So you're not going to have to go through a lengthy process when it comes to writing it, find someone to supervise you. Um Is there someone in your existing network who's able to take on that role or is there someone outside your network? Perhaps someone that you've seen speaking at a conference or someone who's written a paper on your area of interest? Um Networking at meetings and conferences can lead to these serendipitous meetings of people who are potential future supervisors. A top tip for me was really to go to meetings and conferences in person. Um I think the, the networking of coffee is absolutely invaluable. Um And in a world where more and more is online, I think those are the times when you're just starting out, it's important to try and go and be there, face to face with people. Um The NIH R clinical educating education research incubator um has a really helpful um uh tool on the website where you can find potential mentoring opportunities, supervisors. Um There's a kind of um a list of all potential people who you could contact on there. I'm on there, he's on there. So again, have a look at the website and if you're struggling to find a supervisor, one of those people might be someone that you could get in touch with and might have people in mind um Considering relevant theory. Um I know that sounds really daunting initially and I just thought theory, I'm not going there at first, but um it simply means that an idea which explains a phenomena or a thing of interest. Um So there are all sorts of theories out there around world modeling and they're actually very, very relevant to what I'm doing. Um You tend to come across theory and literature so often it's in the um the background or introduction parts of paper, they'll link things into theory or in the discussion section as well. Um And also talking to people, they'll sign post to you to relevant theory being reflexive matters. Um So ask yourself, who are you in this potential research? What's your background? What perspective do you bring? It was important for me to acknowledge that I'm a GP working in a system that feels quite difficult at times. Um And that's what I bring to the research, but that's not something I need to ignore. It's something that adds value to the research. Think about how your experiencing assumptions might impact in the in qualitative research. There isn't the same requirements removed bias as there is in quantitative research. But it's still important to be open about your perspective and experience of the topic and that will matter as well when it comes to writing anything up refining your topic. So based on your reading and discussions, focusing on an area that you think is feasible, relevant and potentially contributes to the field, consider factors including how much time you have. Is this something that you're gonna be doing in your own time or have you got protected time and a fellowship to work on it? What resources are available, access to participants, what approvals are needed. So things like ethical approval is, is required if you're doing anything that involves staff working on NHS premises or, or patients and your supervisor will be a big source of information here. And then finally, um think about involving patients in the public early. Um I remember thinking that my topics are medical education. One. What would patients in the public, you know about that or be interested in? And how wrong I was actually having that first meeting with patient and public contributors was so powerful and it really what they did was bring home to me how important a career as a GP is. What their GP means to them and why this work is important to do. Because if, if what I can do, helps to improve recruitment to general practice, then that's a really positive thing. So it kind of gives you the, the fuel to persevere with your project and realize its value. And the other thing is they, they're all from different backgrounds, they bring really interesting perspectives. So really encourage you to involve p to have PPE involvement very early on in the process and do keep a record of those discussions as well as they'll be helpful to refer back to you later in the process. So, moving on to the aims and research questions. So the aim is broad. Um the research questions are usually more precise. The aim typically um is a verb of the phenomenon. Um Research questions are the questions your research will set out to answer. And as I said, think about theory from the start because it provides a framework for describing or understanding the topic. Don't launch into thinking about methodology and methods too soon. That will come in an organic way as you build in your um aims, research questions, theory, et cetera. Here's a couple of helpful quotes. Um Good questions do not necessarily produce good research but poorly conceived or constructed questions will likely create problems that affect all subsequent stages of the study. And our questions change during the process of research to reflect an increased understanding of the problem, qualitative questions evolve, first iterations a tentative and exploratory, providing a tool for articulating the primary focus. And as I said, my questions changed many, many times and still will probably change before I submit my phd. So this is from a really good article from Karen Mattock, which was published in the clinical teacher, some top tips for writing those research questions. So as we've already said, don't expect the first version to be the final question, identify an important topic that your research can provide new insights, find out from stakeholders and published articles. What the important unanswered questions are good research questions are narrow and specific, but they don't always start that way. Don't expect to make huge leaps in knowledge through your research, make sure your research questions are manageable and achievable in the time that you have, what kind of question you have. So when what, how, why will determine the methods you ultimately use and talking to your supervisor, listening to their advice and refining your questions with their input is important. So um these are my research questions. Um I, so this is my phd that I'm working on now. Um And I'm using realist methods um to explore um how we can support medical students towards careers in general practice through maximizing the potential of role modeling. And so these questions are framed in realist um language. So realist methods are ideal for exploring complex interventions where the outcomes are kind of context specific. So um the outcome from, you know, one medical student or a group of medical students being exposed to one type of role model won't necessarily be the same outcome as the next. But there will be commonalities in the path that affects that kind of ultimate outcome. So realist methods are kind of seeking to understand what the mechanism is behind that change in them, wanting to be a GP or not wanting to be a GP. So realist methods tend to try and understand what works for whom and in what circumstances and they speak in the language of context, mechanisms and outcomes. Um So, so these questions are framed in that way. So I'm exploring what are the potential outcomes of GP role modeling in undergraduate medical education? What are the key contexts whereby GGP role modeling produces its both intended and unintended outcomes? What are the key mechanisms whereby those intended and unintended outcomes occur? And then in what ways can interventions support positive GP role modeling to facilitate careers in general practice and reduce those unintended outcomes over to you for your research questions? Thanks Liddy. Um Yeah. So where I'd left it um in the story was um er that I wanted my overall thing was does it work for, for Western curricula to be implemented in in eastern context? As I said, I then obviously needed to narrow that down. And my particular interest at the time was, was communication skills teaching. And I guess I chose that as well. Cos I think it highlighted some of the differences between different contexts and, and whether or not this w would work. But even the communication skills curricula um with within our program was too big to look at. So I actually then narrowed it down even further to one particular component, a core component of the, of the curricula and then came up as the overall aim to develop a conceptual understanding of the cultural factors that emerged when delivering a core component of the curricula in Malaysia. Um in order to, I think it's quite helpful, I would ask that with any research we do. So what, you know, what, what's the, what's WW when you have get the results, does that is that gonna make any difference to anyone? Cos if not, maybe do something else but to inform your castle and obviously everyone else in the world um of my findings was there was the overall aim and as Lian mentioned before, it's almost like every, every word is important. Um And certainly my supervisor at the time, got me to think through what I meant by a conceptual understanding which I think I understood at the time, what I meant by cultural factors, what each word meant. So that was the overall aim. And then the specific questions, research questions that I wanted answers to were what were the perceived cultural factors that emerge when delivering this core component. Um And then how may these factors actually influence their, their delivery? Um So it was much, much smaller than I thought before than I thought initially I was gonna look at. But actually we then at, within the context of doing uh a small master's project were then deliverable, feasible and answerable and also I think, helpful and useful. Um And if you want to know the answers, I should have, I'll have to put a link up to the publication when II, I'm not saying I'm not particularly promoting my work, but it's more just a, as Leu said, just an example of how an idea developed into actually some specific questions. Um And I wish I'd like to say, yeah, I just did those questions in an hour or two, but I think they took a few months to actually develop and refine um back over to you, Lily. Thanks you. Yes. And just to reassure you, I think mine took years to develop and refine. Um So, and still are being refined. OK. So we've talked for, for nearly half an hour now. So we thought it would be a good opportunity at this point um to send you all off into small groups. Um h how many people do we have here? Not sure. OK. So the idea was to try and send you off into five groups or I think we have a few more groups now. Um I'm not sure how many people will be in each group. Exactly. As I'm not sure of the numbers, but the idea was that we'd get you to talk about your potential ideas, um, to what you've noticed that you'd like to do some research in or perhaps you're already doing some research, perhaps your experienced researcher, um, and some potential aims and research questions um in your area of interest. Um, it would be really helpful if when you were in the small groups, you could put your um cameras on and you will be able to see each other and your microphones will work in that environment. So, um hopefully that process will happen shortly. Um Here, should we say about 15 minutes and then back into the, to the main room to, to share thoughts via the chat? Yes, absolutely. So, 15 minutes, um there are um there are six rooms. If everyone stays, there's about nine or 10 people per room, but we realize you're all busy clinicians and practitioners and educators. So we really not a problem if you need to go. Um But it does mean that some of the groups may be smaller than, than others. Um As Lily said, they're not, unfortunately, we haven't got facilitators. Um So we're really helpful if 11 person um could just um er straight away, just start coordinating and asking people to introduce themselves. So great to find out who you are and where you're working as well as, as Lily said, the specific question, which is what is your area of interest? And how are you getting on with developing a research question that even if you've got one, then that would be really helpful to share for others as well. Um But if one person could clearly facilitate, I will um pop into each room just to make sure that there's enough people have stayed um to, to make each room workable. And then, yeah, and then 15 minutes we'll bring you back in. There won't be a time, there won't be a chance for each group to feed back. Um, but what we'd ask is that if, um, if anyone from each group would like just in the chat box where we come back together to put any specific questions that came up, um, can't promise we'll answer every question. Um, but we will at least point you to an answer even if we won't have time to answer them. So, for example, there's already a question which we'll, we'll cover or we'll point you to the, er, start up getting started session on meth choice of methodologies, which will come on later on in the year. Um, but we'll have a chance just to chat, chat through any important questions that have come up from the groups. Um, I think that's all anything else to add, Lily, I don't think so. Just people are saying they can't see a room option. Can you see in the Yeah, um, it will come up if you click on breakout rooms on the left of the screen, there should then be the option for rooms 1 to 6. We'd ask you just to go in the room that matches with the first name, uh the first letter of your first name. So for example, if your, if your name is Tim, please go to room six which is T to Z Um but just on the left hand side, there should be a icon saying breakout sessions, click on there and then go to the appropriate room. Um If you have any ques any further issues with it, um then do ask questions and we have fantastic, Ollie who will answer all tech problems? Um Well, welcome back everyone. Um I've just popped into the rooms to, to ask people to rejoin. So I think people will be rejoining uh as, as we speak. Um er and sorry to interrupt a couple of the groups that seem to be mid midway through some really interesting discussions that always happens, isn't it? There's some, sometimes some of the best input we get is from the small group sessions and someone closes the room. So apologies for that if you're ha halfway through. Um But hopefully that was um interesting and stimulating. Um as I said, we, we won't go round every room just asking for feedback. Um But we happy to answer any specific questions. Um I'll reiterate this at the end as well. But just to say, this is the second of uh 11 sessions in this series. Um So some of the questions that you will presumably also have following on from developing a research question, which is how do I answer this? What methodologies can I use? How do I analyze, what do I do with the results, et cetera, et cetera um will be answered in future sessions. Um And so I will ask maha if she's still there just to put in a, a link to um the um the, the list of all the sessions in the middle um login, which you'll be able to see. Um And also just to say that this sessions recorded as was last month's session of what is clinical education research and then previous sessions from last year were recorded and um will be on um you can get the download the powerpoints as well as the recorded sessions and that's all available on the clinical in clinical education research incubator website. And again, the link will appear magically er in the er as I speak in the chat box. Um So thanks very much Martin. Um So if you would like to um put in any questions that you've got or that have come up from the, the chat box, um If there weren't anyway, any, that's absolutely fine. But any questions that you've got, um I'll start with um the question that we had earlier um before the sessions. Um which, as I said, we probably will answer in a lot more detail um in a, in a future session. Um But I'm gonna ask Lily the question because I can do that when she's here. Um Which Seila has asked, um how can you determine which method is right for your area? Um For example, you chose realist. Um But what are the others? And how, how do you choose which one to use? Oh, that's, that's a good question. And it is a bit of a minefield. Um But there are useful um resources out there that kind of talk more about different methods in um clinical education. There's a really good textbook. Um Here, you'll have to remind me of the name of it. The one that Elliott Rees has edited recently. Yes, there is. Um which kind of is a, is a beginner's guide to getting started in clinical education research. And that kind of um covers lots of the different methods that you can use and a little bit of explanation around them. Um Supervisors, they always know about the different methods. Um And really, it's just about letting it develop organically, don't go into your research thinking I'm going to do surveys um or I'm going to do focus groups, I'm gonna calculate lots of P values. Um Because your question weren't necessarily aligned to that method. And I had, I had never heard of realist methods. When I started out on my journey and it was only really in the kind of last year before I finalized the, the research plan um that I became aware of them. And when I did it, it was like, oh my goodness, that makes complete sense. I'm wanting to explore a complex intervention here is something that facilitates that process. Um So yes, my top tick would just be, don't rush it and read around. Thanks Lily. Absolutely. I would, I would echo that. Um And the book you mentioned is thank you, Michael. It's called Starting Research in clinical education, funnily enough. Um Which is, we could even have, have guessed. Um There's another question here which is, um, if a study has been done around 15 years ago, but the NHS contract and circumstances have changed. Can I do a study similar to that? Um, my thoughts? Um, and then you can add if you, if you have any, my, my, my first initial thought was um, er, absolutely. Um I mean, depends exactly what the study is. Um I mean, I would have the same question as I'd have for any study, which is, what's the point? Um What, what are you hoping to get out of it? Um And is it worth all the effort, et cetera time money that it will take? But if the answer to that is definite, yes and that there is a point. Um, then I would have thought that you know, a 15 year gap within the NHS and the differences that, um, that have gone on in the last 15 years, which most of us here will know very well. Um, would mean that absolutely, that sort of study would, would be, um, would be interesting to, to see sometimes obviously some studies actually use the fact that a previous study has been done. Um, we did a study a couple of years ago looking at um the, the, the amount of GP teaching within each curricula, er, across the country across the UK. And actually one of the aims was to compare it with previous studies to see if that had actually increased or, or reduced. Um So sometimes you can actually use a previous study to actually um help your, help your current study, I think. Um er, thanks lie for putting in um just so some useful links there and just to say, um again, reiterate what's in the chat box. Um There's a link there to provide feedback and then you get a nice colored. Actually, I don't even know it's colored cos I'm not seeing it, you get a certificate of the after giving the, the feedback um and just to reiterate that um the, oh, it is colored. Thanks. Uh Of course it is cos it's online and so it's free. But yeah, no, I appreciate that. Um these, these sessions are monthly so it's the third Wednesday of every month. Um throughout the academic year. Um As I said that, well, the next session is on um how to do a literature review. So once you've kind of thought of your, your question or thinking of an area, as Lily mentioned, one of the useful things to do is a quick little search um through the different search engines to see what's been written. Um But then once you've, even once you've decided, then the next step would be to do a formal literature review to see what the literature is saying about that topic. Um, so it's Wednesday, the 20th of November, which is the 3rd, 3rd Wednesday of next month. We'll be looking at that. Um, but future sessions look at, um, choosing a methodology, we look at qualitative analysis and quantitative analysis. Um we look at dissemination and, and even then at the end how to, how to follow up all your research by developing a career in clinical education research. Um, yeah, things we'll just promote would be, yeah. Do, do have a look at all those sessions on, on meal and have a look. Um, and the link there is in the chat box for the, er, clinic, er, education research, um, incubator, lots of different um, er, things being put on during the academic year. Um, as I said, we're not particularly pushing anything apart from pushing more, more clinicians um, and more practitioners to do medical education. Um, so if there aren't any more questions. We'll leave it at that. But thank you very much indeed, for your time and for your input. Um I hope that's been helpful and we look forward to seeing you next month if you can make it. Have a good day, everyone and Lily, I'll say, say goodbye. I think we can leave as well and I'll leave. Um, Ollie if Ollie don't mind if you don't mind. Um, he says it's still live technical error and I can't access just trying to rejoin. Yeah. Should we head off? We'll, we'll head off. But thank you very much. Indeed, Lily. And thanks very much, Ollie. Much appreciated. Thank you. Bye.