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OK, that's all good. So the main things that we're gonna like kind of discuss today, um The differences between like an SSC and SSP um The main focus is actually gonna be the SSE because I feel like most people kind of want more information about that, but we'll talk about how they're, they're kind of different um and how to kind of go about organizing them. Then we'll look at how you can maximize your theater experience, your clinic experiences, some of the on call stuff um as well. Then looking at the research and, and project obviously during your SSC block, you do need to do um some sort of project. Um And during your SSP, you can choose to, to do it, although not a um mandatory part of it. Um Then we'll look at some, some of the experiences that um I've had. Um and that George has also um had uh and then just a quick Q and A as well. So, um if you've got any questions throughout um or um you want to save them towards the end, um We can, we can do that. Um Yeah, I think that's, that's everything um, so the SSC versus the SSP, um, obviously in fourth year you got your SSE block a nice six weeks, um, to, to do whatever you want. The main thing with that is that you're the one that's organizing, um, who your supervisor is and, and what you're, you're kind of doing during that block, there are some loose, like, guidelines about, like, what you should do and, and, and those sort of things but I feel like it's quite um flexible and everyone tends to have a slightly different sse um experience loads of people. I know sort of emailed around September, October, um even November, um just to kind of get their, their kind of supervisors in early, there's some like consultants. Um I know that I reach out to you personally that has already like, um like oversubscribed when II reached out, I think in mid October end of October and stuff. So how we are, how we are now. So you kind of want to do that as, as early as, as possible. Um Whereas the SSP is, is in year five, it's a four week block plus two weeks of oncology. Um And you're given a, a supervisor, so you, you don't necessarily have to do as much as much work for that in terms of your, your supervisors in um like your SSE blog, something that I found um was really important is like arranging a call or like a meeting or something like that early on just to, to kind of solidify, like what you want to do, what you want to get out of it. Is it that you want to do more sort of clinics? Is it that you want to do more theater stuff? Is it that you want to spend more time doing, doing research and, and things like that? So doing um uh uh setting a meeting really early um is also, is also, I think really beneficial in both of them. You get to explore the, the specialty in a bit more detail. So with trauma orthopedics, obviously, you get to do um lots of theater things, whether that's kind of um elective or, or trauma and then loads of different uh different clinics as well. You can also do on call stuff. Um I know II did a, a few um on calls and I thought that was quite useful. Um And in addition to, to exploring specialty, you also get to uh do a project, as I said. So whether that's kind of a, a review of something, whether that's sort of um an order, uh a quick um any service evaluations, things like that. So those are the kind of key differences between an SSE during your fourth year and an SSP um in your fifth year. The key thing with um organizing it, as you mentioned is getting, getting it uh in the door early, sending an email because that's probably the best, um best way of doing it here. We've got kind of two examples um of an email like template that you can actually just copy and paste um uh to use on the like um the, the meta, there's like um a list of, of different supervisors that have been willing to, to host students in the past. But you can also just sort of just Google um like former orthopedic surgeons and then get their emails um like that. And that's another nice way to, to kind of reach out um to them, the ones that are like on the mood or list are obviously gonna be more sort of contacted, more oversubscribed. So thinking about so some of the ones that aren't on there may be your best bet, especially if you um reach out slightly later on in, in the year. You wanna make sure you're being quite memorable in how you approach it as well. So being slightly more specific about the things that you wanna get from it in your initial email is quite useful. So on the right, you can see that there's, there's a bit more mention of um some theater time and, and clinics and things like that and that just shows that you're a bit more eager to kind of get involved in specific things rather than just saying, oh, I want to do my like se with you for, for six weeks. Can we uh can we do it So, um, I think that's, that's always quite useful and if you've done any sort of projects in the past, if you've done maybe like a case report or something in your, your kind of part two year, it would be good to mention that as well if it's sort of anatomy or um, sort of surgically related as, as well. I think that's going to be the, the main thing um, with organizing your sse brilliant and just on the point of, uh, who you get a super Pfizer, you get given a list which is brilliant and most people use that, but I've got friends who did all sorts of stuff. So, one spend his time, er, with the Surrey county cricket club coach, um, or like their, their, um, physio on more medical side and spend half the time just watching cricket so you can do all sorts of different stuff. Um, so moving on to what you'll be doing on your SSE. So obviously as a side, which is more research, you have to produce some, some sort of project. Um, the other main thing you'll be doing is, er, spending time in theaters and clinics. So, er, this was one of the big things for why I did TN O because it's an especially specialty where you can get involved with that kind of thing. Um, see patients yourselves. So, just as a sort of introduction, cos um, you might not have seen any. So, far at C like at Cambridge. Um, with theaters, there are two different regions where they do the orthopedic stuff. So their main theater 16 to 19, um, if you've been into theaters, they're slightly off to the side. So when you go in, um, most of theaters are in one corridor and if you go off the corridor separate to that and go to the end, um, above the sort of food hall bit, that's where the TNA theaters are. The other place is the CMS H, that's the movement surgical hub, which is by the car park behind the roses right around the back of Edinburgh's. Um, they've built that after COVID to try and get through, get through operations more quickly. So it's, I think they've got three theaters there and a ward or two. and it'll sort of be one knee, one hip, one spine or something on a day and they'll be getting through operations like hip and knee replacements. Um, but it's a really good place to get involved and it's a bit more modern than some of the stuff in Edinburgh's. Um, so it obviously starts early. So as of no surgery, the team briefs at 8 a.m. it's better to get there for the start so that you can meet the other people and meet the team and it's obviously easier to join operations if, er, you've introduced yourself at the beginning rather than when the surgeon's already scrubbed in um, there are various links you can look at on here. Uh, so Cambridge orthopedics have a youtube channel. There's an app for looking at approaches and incisions that are specific to orthopedics. Um, and any anatomy always helps, er, the best thing to do is to get involved. So, er, this is obviously easier when you're on an sc because you're linked with one surgeon, um, or with their registrars. So you're gonna know them before and when you turn up they'll probably be expecting you. Er, and that's definitely an easy way to get scrubbed in as well. Um, but just us scrubbing often with orthopedics, it's easier to scrub in and see stuff than with some other types of operations. The only thing is they're, they're pretty careful about infection controls to make sure you scrub well. And, uh, they always do, they almost, I think, almost always double glove to wear two pairs of gloves, which is a bit different, some of the other surgical specialties. Um, and so you can either, er, it's worth finding some gloves before to see what size you are. Um, and then with the two sets of gloves, either use the same size or go a sa half size down for the outer glove so that it's a bit tighter. Um, then onto clinics it's a really good place to take histories and do examinations. Um, you can all sorts of questions from the surgeon, take notes or read up about the case before. I think almost all of the orthopedic stuff is in clinic one. So if you're going through outpatients and turn right, it will be your first one on the right, which, uh, there is signposted and you should be able to find it from the main hospital or from outpatients. I'd say that you might find in regional places, clinics are run slightly differently. Um, they possibly have a bit more time for patients. Whereas Adam Brooks often they'll put the patients in side rooms separate from the office and the surgeon will go into each room one by one. So have all of sort of five minutes with the patient. But um if you're working one on one with a surgeon for an SSE, then they should get you involved with the examination, especially if there's a good sign or something. Um, and you'll be able to see all the scans and were with the one I did, uh tends to be the surgeon in the registrar in the same room. So you could go to both cases depending on what was more interesting in a way. So the next slide is a video about scrubbing in. So I don't know how much, um, whether you've had teaching or scrubbing in yet, but this is on the Cambridge orthopedics channel. Do you want to get everything on to be? So, put on a mask and er hat before you always need a hat when you're in theater and make sure you put on your mask, then open up your gown and put it on the side before you start scrubbing. Or the other people can obviously help you with that. And especially the first time you get, it's definitely worth getting one of the nurses in there or um those practitioners to help you with it. So you use brush to clean your nails, clean your hands, clean your fingers and down your arms, then move on to washing your hands and your arms. So I'm really people teaching on the different steps of hand washing. It's basically just a lot more important when it comes to, er, scrubbing in. And do you want to aim to have the, uh, cleaning stuff on your skin for up to five minutes, I think. And so you want everything moving down, so clean your hands and work your way down to your elbow and let everything drip off the bottom of your elbow. No, I think you should have teaching in Cambridge and Po regional hospitals at some point with this. Um, make sure there's someone there to help you so they can tie up the back to your guards once you've got the undercard on the outer guards are far easier to push on cos you can touch whichever parts of it. Brilliant. So hopefully that helps a bit. Um, and I don't want to talk about this, but, yeah, sure. So, obviously, um, George has talked about the, the kind of clinics and the theaters and, and, and those kind of bits. But like, obviously a lot of people are thinking like ahead in, in their careers and stuff. And so one of the things that a lot of people use the, the kind of sc book for is like boosting applications, whether that's kind of poor surgical training or um even thinking kind of further down in terms of like specialty training. So it's really useful um to kind of get involved in um a project, I think purely because of the fact that you could just get some some points really easily. You've got that kind of dedicated six weeks to, to kind of work through it. And then you can continue for as long as you, you kind of want to um with, with your, with your project. So like, personally, I'm working on something that I started in my SSE. Um and now I'm like next week, I'm, I'm going to do a poster presentation, right? So it doesn't necessarily have to be on the, the kind of six weeks like like to get everything done. But that's kind of to, to give you the, the kind of time to, to think of a project because it can be quite difficult to even just find like a good project that, that you can see all the way through. And then we start, we start to develop um the kind of introduction um and the proposal and, and these sorts of things, I think that's really um really useful in, in your sse. So whether that's kind of trying to be like a first author of paper to kind of get your, your maximum points there um to maybe do like an audit or AQ I project um and presenting that. Um and then also really importantly, trying to get your um your kind of cases up as well, making sure you've like set up an account um for your like portfolio so that you can record all the the kind of theater experiences that you've you've had. And as you can see here, it's, it's 40 cases for, for the maximum points, the kind of core surgical training like applications recently changed this year. So it's no longer like points and scores, it's sort of like a ranking from like a to, to E and stuff, but I put a link um uh on the, on the kind of bottom, right? But basically the, the kind of key domains here that you see on screen are um haven't really changed. So making sure you're, you're trying to get involved in this as much as possible, making sure you're, you're kind of scrubbing in. Um hopefully that's something that you're, you're going to be quite keen on because you want to do an Essy in like, like PN O. But even if it's not necessarily in um from orthopedic specifically, any sort of surgical specialties, just kind of get involved in as many case as possible. And then, yeah, as I said, doing a a project during your six weeks is is also really beneficial. And then what are the supervisors looking for? So these are just kind of tweets from various um consults you may recognize some of the some of the names um here, essentially the the the kind of key over overarching me message here is be engaged, get involved, um introduce yourself and, and try and get uh try and get a bit more experience in like theaters, maybe some of the imaging stuff, these sorts of things. Um and this is directly from like the consultants themselves. So um if you're kind of engaged and you're, you're willing to kind of get involved, they're more likely to give you more sort of opportunities. So even for example, if you reach out to a consultant who potentially isn't your SSC supervisor during your block, but you still see that they're doing some cool stuff, you can always ask them to, to kind of get involved and they may then give you a project separate to your SSC project. So you can get involved in like multiple different things um purely just by being keen and engaged. So, in summary, um when I, so when I was doing my sc it was first block of the year. So I hadn't really been in theater as much before that and big part of what I wanted to do was to just get into theater, um, especially in something II wanted to do. So I was doing mine and knees. Um, so I think just going to c clinics and theaters in the first place is one of the best things you can do, especially if you're going with the same surgeon over and over again, you get some rapport and get to do a bit more over time. Um You know, you're gonna be able to scrub in each time if you ask. And um uh that's one of the best bits about it because you're just doing something that you're a bit more interested in. Uh the other side of it is obviously doing your project. Uh It's completely up to you, how much you want to do for that and what type of projects you want to do. Um, there are various other things that you can do. So MDT meetings are good. Uh, although they start pretty early, er, and obviously through that you can go to any, any of the trauma lists, meet, meet other surgeons in the specialty, they may have other projects going on which you can also get involved in. Um So in terms of other opportunities, there are all sorts of things, conference courses, volunteering, it'd be worth looking at all the kudos, social media because there are a lot of opportunities advertised through that. There are several of us going off to Manchester at the end of November for the, er, trainees and medical students orthopedics conference. Um, and they have a precongress day which includes several stations teaching you various things about orthopedics. Um, well, it says not all projects already made. So, uh, it, it, you likely won't go in with a title of something you're gonna do and write about and have everything ready for you. Um, with mine it was a bit more. II turned up to the clinic. Well, I, once I'd emailed the surgeon, he said, oh, come and join in clinic for a day. So I spent the morning with him and we discussed various options at that point, worked out what we can do what we could do from there. But just remember that audits and quits are so that quote improvement project, they're worth a lot of application points and relatively easy in the grand scheme of things. If you, if you get to know a surgeon who's got something like that going on, um, and they're worth a lot. So you don't have to dive in at the deep end and try and get your name on the most difficult paper because the other thing about that is that would really take a lot longer to do. Um, the final bit is have fun with it. So I just think that uh to be honest, the most important bit about it is just get into theater and get into clinic and something you want to do. Um, I II, it depends on your personal preference, but I think most people probably more interested by the clinical side. So it's just a brilliant opportunity to be able to choose what you want to do for six weeks and just focus on something a bit more niche. Um, rather than being in something different with a different doctor every day. It's nice to be able to turn up to the theater and know the surgeon and it'll be, um, you know, she'll be like, come and join me at the table scrubbing. So the final bit we want to talk about is our various experiences of what we've done for us. So, first of all, we have Raju's the president of Kos, um, who's done various different things over the year, including post presentations, presented at conferences. Uh I think he and Lara, another girl on committee are on Bomber, which is the er Medical Students Orthopedics Association across the country. Um, and there are various different things that we can get involved in. So, especially with the committee, we had a, a journal club a few weeks ago which organized one of the orthopedics companies. We had a dinner and drinks at a pub down in Grace and various of the trainees from East Anglia presented uh different papers to discuss. Um and that had several consultants and trainees from Adam Brooks as well. So, not a good way to network um but your sse can basically take you anywhere and it's just the best first step to get involved in research and meet doctors who can help you. So for my like se um I kind of hinted at some of the things that um that I did, but I kind of wanted a mix between sort of like actually getting loads of hands on experience and then spending time working on my project, but also just vising because my se was kind of towards the um the end of fourth year. So I wanted to kind of make sure like I could cram in as much as I could and then also spend some time um uh like working uh on my, on my project as well. So three weeks in Cambridge, I did like a various um uh I scrubbed into loads of different things. So like former lists, um always like, like 5th 16 is always like something trauma related. Um But like in any of those other ones, you can, you can also um you can also scrub in and see what's going on and the Elective center as well. I think the like, I think for me that was personally like where I got the most amount of like hands on experience. Um The the patients tend to be a bit more stable and like safe and um I feel like there's a slightly more relaxed like attitude there. Um Maybe it's just because it's like a separate location stuff. But I think for me, like, I found that like really um really useful. So I definitely recommend going to the the movement hub and and seeing what's going on. Um and then clinic. So um specifically like, II spent some time with Mr Kang and doing some of the the kind of like upper limb shoulder clinics. And I think that was really who are actually even just for like Osk practice and knowing how to do like an MSK exam and having a consultant, like, tell you what, like you need to do what special tests and, and these sorts of things, I think that like, even if I wasn't necessarily doing an se or like was interested in trauma and orthopedics that alone, I think was, was, was really useful and then some on calls. So following like one of the regs going around the, the hospital. So um going to like A&E going to some of the wards and, and these different, these different things. So I think those are the kind of main things that I took away from uh my se in Cambridge. And then I just spent sort of three weeks, as I said, working on a, a systemic review that um that I'm still doing to this day. So, um it's definitely a long process but definitely try and get something kick started off during the se and you can see like you, you, you might never know where it can, can take you. And so for my, I've already mentioned a bit, so I was the, the first block of the year. So really hadn't had much clinical experience by that point. Um But during my uh ccm I went into clinic with Mr Melton and we sort of saw various patients for knee issues and then discussed possible projects so we could do then um I'd normally spend two days a week in theater. So what he does one trauma less and then uh in the CM H on Mondays, um with that, it's very sort of organized, it would usually be four operations in a day. So say three ACL S and a knee replacement or two knee replacements, an ACL and an NCL or something like that. Um There's a clinic each week in clinic one. it's all completely optional and you, you can just discuss with your supervisor what you want to do. I would be more interested in doing that side of things. Um But if you want to, you can spend more time on the research side. Um So I did a literature review at the same time, looked at a new, new type of operation which they don't do in the UK or us. But there are plenty of papers from India and Pakistan where they've been doing it. Um So just sort of looked at the current stage of the literature and whether it's something that's worth thinking about doing over here. Um, and I sort of continued that as well and he's got some registrars involved to help with that. So you can take it as far as you want to. Uh, if you want to leave it after your six weeks and just submit the various necessary bits to get it ticked off. That's fine. And if you want to take it further, that's fine as well. Um And it's just a brilliant place to start networking and get a few connections so that you can start getting a bit of research in and going to clinics in the, to a different surgeons. So that's all that we have today. So um obviously, we might as well tailor this to you and let us know if you have any questions, whatever stage you're at, whether you've organized orthopedics SSC S already, um whether you're thinking about it or about an anything to do with S CS or S SPS even. Thank you very much. I think two people have also joined, which is good. Um But I was just wondering what did you mean by all the quality improvement projects? And also how do you get into them? So, so an audit is like um like an audit and QR projects um are quite similar in audits where you kind of look at like guidelines and see, well, like is what we're doing, like in line with what the guidelines are saying and then a like a QR project is a quality improvement project. So it's not necessarily comparing it to a guideline, but it's comparing it to um like, for example, last year, what were you doing compared to like this year? Are we seeing like an improvement in like outcomes or, or something like that? So that's essentially like what an, an A QR project is. Um You, I think you'll probably have a lecture at some point either this year or the start of like next year. I can't remember when we had it, but like they kind of go through it. Um uh Again, the main thing is like, you can reach out to the supervisor, like the supervisor will know if there's like an A to be done or QR project to be um to be done. You don't necessarily have to go to like a supervisor and say, I think that this thing needs to be improved or this thing needs to be audited. Usually they'll have like an idea. So you can like, in your email, you can um or your, your kind of introductory um session with them. You can just kind of say, well, I want to get involved in like a project. I don't mind if it's like a bigger systematic review or like something that like, like is an audit or Q I project. I think there's quite a lot of QR projects going on in like um in the department. I know Mr Kang's quite, um, like, keen on, on more like medical students getting involved in, in that. So, um, I don't, I don't think there's necessarily really a shortage, you just need to kind of mention it and they'll hopefully give you, um, something to do. Yeah, there are, there are certainly lots that need to be done and, I mean, that's the kind of thing that would be very difficult for you to say this is what I'd like to do an audit on. It's like he's like, so you end up doing one at GP and FR as well. And so I, I'm doing one at GP, which has to do with whether, er, patients at the GP surgery who are on bisphosphonates have their five year review because it's part of the guidelines on whether on a sort of after five years on the medication, you're meant to review them and do various things, um, which obviously hasn't happened most of the time and I think most people don't seem to know about it, but, so it will be something like that where hopefully they can suggest something. Um, and there are plenty of audits and quality improvement projects going on. That's really useful. Thank you. And you both mentioned doing like an elective in the CMS H, was it an elective rather than just like a continuation of your SSC? It's, um, so that, that's elective surgery. So, uh, so the, the difference, so you've either got emergency surgery which would be happening in, er, I mean, if it's trauma, it will be, er, the 16 to 19 or, er, can occasionally be 34 if there are various other injuries are. Um, so that's emergency surgery. And then the other side is elective surgery which is basically surgery which is scheduled weeks, weeks or months before. Um, so say you're gonna have a knee or hip replacement that will be scheduled for several months. Um, it's just called elective surgery. Uh, in terms of electives. Er, we're actually going to have a separate talk on that. So, the elective at the end of fifth of the summer, um, we're going to have a separate talk and that you can do in Cambridge as well. Um, but I think lots of people end up doing that abroad as well. So I think we're gonna have a few people who graduated last year, speaking about what they did. Um, I know several of them went to South Africa and did trauma and other things like that. Thank you for clarifying. Uh, can I ask you a question quickly? Yeah, sure. Go for it. Um, kids for the talk as well. That, that was useful. Uh, when you mentioned about maybe reaching out to supervisors that are on the list, uh, that the university gives us, uh, how would you go about, like finding the names and emails of these people in the first place? So, what I did was like, if you, if you just type in like, former orthopedic surgeons, Adam Brooks, there's like an NHS website that comes up and it's got like their, their kind of emails, um, and like names and, and stuff like that there. Um, you can also, I guess, reach out to your do I know, like, some people at my college, I reach out to their do s and like, they may know some like surgeons just because of like their, their kind of networks and stuff. So there's also that, but you can actually just Google it and like find that email and then, or even if you just find their name, you can usually find their like um their CRS ID just from like searching. So um yeah, that's how I would say at least that's how like I went about it. Oh OK. Thank you. Yeah, that sounds quite simple. Oh, I had another question actually. Um how do you kind of not ensure, but I can do your best in trying to make sure that you can get like apa publication out of your sse. What are the things that you can maximize to try to get the publication out? I think it's a, it's a difficult thing cos it ii mean, it's the same with when you're contacting supervisors, obviously, it's something that everyone does want. Um But I was speaking to a surgeon in and actually a transplant one the other week and he was saying that it's a shame that almost a shame that students don't just come into theater for the enjoyment of it anymore. They all seem to want to get something from it. So it's I II find it a difficult one to put in an email when you're asking about it. Obviously, I think the key thing is they will all have research going on and the chance of it getting published is a in a large part to do with how much effort you want to put into it and how enthusiastic you show that you are to them because, um, they've all got registrars working for them and things and those reg registrars need to get publications as well. So even if it's a single person project, then it can definitely get taken further and other people can help you if you're keen for it to. Um, obviously some people are lucky and get put onto something that's 80% done and they help with the final few bits. Um I, I'm, I'm, I'm not sure what you think harsh, but I think it can, it can often be difficult to ask in the first place, you know. Yeah, I think that like, I like, I totally agree. And the email I don't think is necessarily the best place to, to like put it, but I would definitely say you wanna either drop it or hint it at like some point quite early on so that the supervisor is kind of on the same pages as you might not want to say, you want to do like a publication, but you may want to say you want to get involved in some research and something like that. So it might be a different way to kind of word it, um, in terms of like making sure it, like making sure it kind of get through, um, like to an actual, like PUBMED index. Um bit of research, I think, yeah, as, as George was saying, it's about the kind of time that you're willing to, to kind of dedicate to it. A lot of the times you can kind of do enough to like do the se and get your kind of marks. But there like that quality is nowhere near the kind of quality that you need for like an actual um like publication. So for example, you need to do like a literature review for your e but could that compared to like an actual systematic review is significantly different. And so like just being aware of, of that and usually having like a supervisor who's willing to, to kind of like support you and maybe has like a registrar that like doing something. Um um As George was saying that because obviously they need the publication. So like maybe even like liaison liaising with the the consultant to speak to a specific registrar or, or something like that so that there's that kind of like more direct um communication, obviously, consultants are are quite busy, whereas red trials are slightly more like contactable. So um I think that's always um a useful thing to, to do as well. So try and have like a um like that conversation early, but also um just be aware that it, it does quite take quite a lot of effort. Well, thank you very much. So, if you um obviously anything now, if you want to, if you don't have any more questions, then, uh always feel free. We're both on the committee of KO, so always feel free to get in touch, especially with social medias or anything like that, um or on the various whatsapp chats and ask anything you want, um, and keep an eye out for future events as well, cos we're going to be doing separate other talks, um including on electives for after the 50th summer, actually, a couple of things a lot. Um I was just wondering. So I've, I've talked with a um supervisor and well not supervisor, a consultant in plastic surgery actually. And he's quite keen to like, take me on, but he's based in Cambridge and right now I've started my Bedford Lock. So, but I do wanna almost get a head start with my SSC just so that I can, I can lengthen the time I can spend on considering I'm starting in February. So, what do you guys suggest? I do like, should I attend surgeries in Bedford just to get a feel of what plastic surgery is like. And then I start like in February or in December when I'm back or I'm just I II, I'm not sure what to do whilst I'm here in Bedford and ICC supervisor is like in Cambridge. I think it's definitely worth getting involved when you can. Um, so it, I was in Ipswich last year and it was run, uh, everything's run very differently so it's good to see it from a different side. Also. The other thing is, uh, a lot of what happens in Cambridge is a lot more specialists. So it's definitely worth seeing some of the more routine operations when you're in your regional hospital. Um, in terms of what you should do with the chemistry supervisor, you can absolutely start it early if you want to. Um, it's certainly worth going to a clinic or theater or something with them beforehand, er, partly to just discuss what you're going to be doing. Um, I mean, obviously it's a bit more difficult if you're in bed for Monday to Friday. But when you're back, that's certainly worth doing and it's definitely worth getting involved, especially while you're away as well. Yeah. And like, if you just wanna arrange a, like a quick call with them over Zoom or something like that, like, just to kind of make sure it's like, set up just so like someone else doesn't take your, your supervisor or something like that. Um, I think that would be, that would be useful. Just have like a quick zoom call with them, um, or a quick chat because obviously it's like, it's not really feasible for you to go like in person to, to meet them, like in a clinic or something like that, but like see what you can see what you can do, you know. Thank you very much. Oh, is there something that you guys wish someone had told you? Um, in fourth year? Like, aside from everything in the presentation, I think for me it's like everyone's sc is, is different. So, like, even if you see someone doing like XY and Z, it doesn't necessarily mean that like, that's the right way or that's the only way to, to kind of do it. Like, obviously, even like we, me and George did, like, both did form orthopedic like things, but like our experiences were, were completely different. So, um, don't necessarily be afraid of like, if your experience isn't the same as someone else's, I think I was a bit like, well, like, like these people in these specialties are doing like Xy and Z. So why, why am I not doing it? Well, it doesn't really matter, like I enjoyed it. So, um, I think that's probably what I would, I would say. Mhm Yeah, definitely. And, and the final thing is like, not all my friends doing surg cholestases were allowed to scrub it. And so if it's something that you're keen to do, then discuss it with the supervisor before, I think with most of t, with, with most of TN O it should be fine. Um, but I had a friend doing Opsonin who wasn't really allowed to, was it just the specialty that limited them or was it something else? II, it can be down to the supervisor, to be honest. Um, I think with plastics or TN O they're fairly good on the whole. Good. Ok. Ok. Thank you very much. This has been really, really useful. Thank you.